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Buy the Numbers

Mike Payne
Buy the Numbers
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  • The One Big Beautiful Bill: What Manufacturers Need to Know Now, #23
    When I first heard about the “One Big Beautiful Bill,” I knew we had to break it down for the MakingChips audience. This isn’t just another tax update—it’s a massive, 900-page piece of legislation with real implications for manufacturers like us. Whether you're thinking about buying equipment, expanding your facility, hiring more people, or selling your business down the road, the OBBB touches nearly every part of the decision-making process. That’s why I called up my friends at CLA—Susan Roberts and Steve Combs—two tax pros who spend every day helping manufacturers figure out what’s changing, what’s staying the same, and what you need to do now. In this episode, we sort through what’s “informational” and what’s “actionable”—so you can stop guessing and start planning. We talk about everything from the return of 100% bonus depreciation, to how you can now expense R&D costs again (finally), to smart moves around entity selection and estate planning. There’s even a little salt cap drama in there. If you want to get ahead before year-end—or avoid getting caught off guard—this episode’s for you. Let’s get into it and talk about how this “big, beautiful” bill can work for you… not against you. Segments (0:18) Grow your top and bottom-line with CLA (1:33) Learn more about Susan Roberts and Steve Combs (4:05) What’s “informational” vs. “actionable” in the bill (7:42) Bonus depreciation is back—100% write-offs retroactive to Jan 19, 2025 (10:01) How cost segregation studies unlock more depreciation for recent building purchases (12:20) Why you shouldn’t buy machines just for the deduction (13:45) QBI deduction (20%) made permanent (and what that means) (17:48) Entity selection: Is it time to consider a C Corp? (19:30) R&D can now be fully expensed—unlocking credits, cash flow, and retroactive deductions for everyday shop work (27:37) Why you should listen to Buy the Numbers (30:17) Interest expense deductions get easier for manufacturers in 2025 (32:00) Limitations on capitalizing interest into inventory coming in 2026 (33:21) Individual tax deductions: SALT cap increased from $10K to $40K (with phaseout) (38:02) Why PTET (pass-through entity tax) strategies still matter (40:39) Advanced manufacturing credit for semiconductors increased from 20% to 35% (42:09) Clarifying that buying tax credits is still an option for large C Corps (46:55) Estate exemption increased to $15M and indexed for inflation (48:02) Opportunity Zone deferral extended—now with rolling 10-year plan (50:10) Low-hanging fruit for 2025: R&D recapture, bonus depreciation, cost seg studies (53:40) The risk of unintended consequences without a tax advisor (55:01) Final verdict: Is the One Big Beautiful Bill actually beautiful for manufacturing? (1:01:16) Don’t get burned by recruiters who don’t understand manufacturing Resources mentioned on this episode CLA’s Website Susan Roberts - [email protected] Steve Combs - [email protected] Tax Cuts and Jobs Act Manufacturing Grants Made Simple Hire MFG Leaders Connect With MakingChips www.MakingChips.com On Facebook On LinkedIn On Instagram On Twitter On YouTube
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  • Smart Money Moves: How to Grow Your Shop Without Breaking the Bank, Ep #22
    I’m halfway through the year and, like many of you, I feel as if it’s still February. Orders are steady but not spectacular, and every headline seems designed to keep shop owners awake at night. That’s why I invited my friend and financing partner Ty Willis back on Buy the Numbers—because cautious optimism only works if your cash flow can keep up with your ambitions. Ty funds machine tools every day, from three-spindle startups to $40 million fab shops, so he sees the real score behind the press releases. In this conversation we pull the veil off equipment financing: when to borrow, when to walk away, and how to keep your banker, your line of credit, and your future robots playing nicely together. We also unpack why a “slow-and-steady foundation” beats any shiny new five-axis—unless that five-axis comes with the cash-flow runway to feed it. You’ll hear Ty’s three phases of lending wisdom, my own war stories of growing Hill Manufacturing (including a 24-spindle acquisition we’re closing in two weeks), and a practical playbook for calling your shot six months before you sign a PO. We even run a lightning round on interest rates, Section 179, and whether the latest “no payments for six months” gimmick is really a deal. If you’re tired of financing offers that treat every shop the same—or tired of hearing “rates are too high, maybe next year”—this episode gives you the numbers, questions, and mindset to finance growth without betting the farm.  You will want to hear this episode if you are interested in... (0:00) Ty’s “run lean first” mantra and why slow & steady wins the race (0:25) Check out Verdant Commercial Capital to gain a partner in your corner (1:30) Ty’s path from tech to ten years in independent equipment finance (4:53) Job shops are softer, DOD/aerospace is humming, and diversification is critical (10:09) Using cash flow as the real growth lever; the 24-spindle acquisition example (11:49) Ty’s three phases of lending maturity (valuing consultative restraint over volume) (17:36) Case study: consolidating eight lenders into one partner to free a CFO’s week (22:33) Automation financing myths—why cobots and AGVs often outlive spindles and deserve funding (26:40) Sign up for updates about Modern Machine Shop’s Top Shops 2025 (27:04) Breathing new life into 15-year-old machines with robots, bar feeders, better workholding (29:52) Pre-qualification and “calling your shot” before IMTS or FABTECH (33:27) South-Dakota-to-Florida move: financing a $500K 5-axis and hidden relocation costs (37:41) Chicago fab/machine shop’s methodical growth with bargain used five-axis machines (41:42) Ty’s four-step engagement playbook: 20-minute call, one-page soft-pull app, roadmap, relationship (44:19) Lightning round: rates, imperfect books, Section 179 reality, deferred-payment traps (55:28) Why you need to listen to the Lights Out podcast Resources & People Mentioned Smart Money Moves: Equipment Financing Tips with Ty Willis, Ep #5 The Cashflow Advantage: Why the Right Banker Makes All the Difference, Ep #6 Banking Secrets for Manufacturers: How to Secure the Cash You Need, Ep #12 Sign up for updates about Modern Machine Shop’s Top Shops 2025 Why we leverage the expertise of CliftonLarsonAllen Connect with Ty Willis Check out Verdant Commercial Capital to gain a partner in your corner Verdant Commercial Capital on LinkedIn Connect with Ty on LinkedIn Connect With Buy the Numbers Follow on LinkedIn Connect with Mike Payne on LinkedIn Subscribe to Buy the Numbers on Apple + Spotify Audio Production and Show Notes by - PODCAST FAST TRACK
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  • The Marketing Metrics That Actually Matter, Ep #21
    What happens when a former MLB.com writer ends up leading marketing for one of the most complex machine tool portfolios in the country? You get a masterclass in translating business goals into real marketing ROI.  In this episode of Buy the Numbers, Jon Star—Director of Marketing at Methods Machine Tools—joins us for a conversation about data-driven marketing, building trust with job shops, and how to actually prove your impact in manufacturing. Jon shares his winding path from sports journalism to enterprise tech to metalworking, revealing how his background in internal communications and executive messaging taught him the metrics that matter.  He explains how marketing can (and should) directly support sales by understanding how the company makes money, building content around that mission, and tracking revenue—not just leads. We also dive into the real challenges job shops face when trying to diversify into new industries, and how methods like CRM implementation, service-first messaging, and persona-driven marketing help shops target the right customers with confidence.  Whether you're a machine tool distributor, job shop owner, or marketer trying to earn your seat at the executive table, this episode is packed with practical insights.  You will want to hear this episode if you are interested in... (0:00) Welcome to Buy the Numbers—Nick finally makes his co-host debut (0:46) Stay tuned to learn more about Top Shops 2025! (1:54) Jon Star’s unexpected journey from baseball writing to industrial marketing (8:34) Knowing how your company makes money is the foundation of great marketing (12:04) Branded house vs. house of brands explained (14:22) Selling to small job shops vs. large enterprises (15:50) Why shop owners need to market differently based on business goals (17:05) Hill’s strategy for diversifying into new industries (19:04) How Methods supports diversification through engineering and service (22:25) Measuring marketing success and hitting the right customer pain points (27:51) Why a focus on service is the best sales strategy (29:25) Grow your top and bottom line with CLA (30:03) What we’ve learned from building empathy into our marketing (31:37) Jon’s first six months: Listening, shadowing, and learning from the field (35:05) Internal dashboards vs. “sicko spreadsheets”: Jon’s tracking habits (37:41) Mike’s CRM journey—when it’s finally time to scale (39:00) MQL vs. SQL: What they mean and why they matter (46:18) Attribution doesn’t have to be perfect—but it has to be useful (47:47) Sales, marketing, and product must operate as one flywheel (51:45) Why you need to talk to your long-standing customers (and team) (56:05) Don’t be afraid to start with something basic (1:05:35) How ProShop can help you achieve on-time delivery Resources & People Mentioned Marketing that Attracts Work Meaghan Ziemba on MakingSparks Connect with Guest Name Connect with Jon on LinkedIn [email protected] Methods Machine Methods on Instagram How ProShop can help you achieve on-time delivery Connect With Buy the Numbers Follow on LinkedIn Connect with Mike Payne on LinkedIn Subscribe to Buy the Numbers on Apple + Spotify Audio Production and Show Notes by - PODCAST FAST TRACK
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  • Beyond the Books: Turning Your Accounting into a Competitive Advantage, Ep #20
    What if I told you that your accounting function could be your greatest weapon in the fight for better margins, smarter decisions, and stronger growth? Too often, we treat accounting like a chore—just another box to check, another invoice to send. But if you're serious about building a resilient, efficient, and scalable manufacturing business, then it's time to look at accounting as a strategic function. In this episode, I’m joined by three experts from CLA—Phil Hanke, Mary Strand, and David Mauch—who live and breathe operational accounting for manufacturers. We dig into how small to midsize shops can build better systems, forecast more effectively, and make real-time decisions rooted in good data (not gut feelings). We’re not talking about spreadsheets for the sake of spreadsheets. We’re talking about boots-on-the-floor insight, setting up your ERP and accounting tools the right way, and actually using the information you collect to improve margins, reduce waste, and grow confidently. From budgeting basics to cash cycle calculations, this episode is packed with practical takeaways. If your current financial reporting feels like a black box—or if your books are still being run by a well-meaning family member without formal training—you’ll want to lean in. Because accounting isn’t just about reconciling the past; it’s about owning your future.  You will want to hear this episode if you are interested in... (0:00) Mike shares a personal success story about ROI from investing in ProShop ERP (0:20) Why I believe you need to invest in ProShop ERP (2:25) Introducing guests from CLA and why their work matters to manufacturers (5:04) The labor gap isn’t just on the floor—it’s in accounting and admin roles too (8:26) Mary defines “operational accounting” and why it starts on the shop floor (12:54) Steel toes and inventory flows: how to diagnose inefficiency at ground level (14:53) Budgeting isn’t optional—Mary breaks down how to start simple and get real (19:11) Why budgeting should be a living, breathing document (20:46) Phil walks through how to turn planning into performance KPIs (24:32) Gross margin, product-line profitability, and how to use your income statement (27:43) Working capital and cash cycles—don’t let your AR terms bury your business (29:55) Pricing strategy that accounts for your cost of capital (33:00) Stay tuned for more information about Top Shops 2025 (33:25) Frequency of financial monitoring—daily vs. monthly vs. quarterly (34:47) Predictive vs. lagging indicators and building a metrics dashboard (38:38) David explains how to collect actionable data without fancy tools (43:48) Connecting floor-level data to pricing, burden rates, and margins (47:22) How 5S and competition drive operator engagement in performance metrics (53:03) The danger of underutilizing your ERP or treating QuickBooks like a checkbook (56:00) Why financial statements should align with what’s happening on your floor (58:16) Low-hanging fruit you should focus on now (1:01:47) Check out the Machine Shop Mastery podcast Resources & People Mentioned Stay tuned for more information about Top Shops 2025 Machine Shop Mastery Connect with Mary, Phil, and David with CLA Mary Strand Phil Hanke David Mauch Connect With Buy the Numbers Follow on LinkedIn Connect with Mike Payne on LinkedIn Subscribe to Buy the Numbers on Apple + Spotify Audio Production and Show Notes by - PODCAST FAST TRACK
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  • Golf, Grit, and CNC: Inside the Launch of Hanna Golf, Ep #19
    Most golfers obsess over their gear—but almost none of them build it. Jared Doerfler did. After playing college golf and spending years in sales, he found himself pulled back into the game he loved—but this time, through the lens of product creation. With zero machining experience, he quit his job, bought a beginner CNC mill, and decided to manufacture putters himself, from his garage. In this episode, we dive into how Jared taught himself CAD/CAM, figured out the physics behind great putter design, and slowly carved out a niche in a crowded marketplace. This wasn’t a white-label brand with flashy headcovers—it was a soul-first, steel-cut, full-stack operation. You’ll hear how golf gave Jared the idea, how family gave him the work ethic, and how sheer persistence turned that idea into a functioning business. From naming each model after towns tied to his grandfather to prototyping for months just to get the sound right, Jared’s approach to design and manufacturing is anything but casual. Whether you’re a golfer, a builder, or someone with a product idea burning in your brain, this episode is a masterclass in starting from zero—with nothing but curiosity, grit, and a love for the game. You will want to hear this episode if you are interested in... (0:15) Stay tuned: Top Shops 2025 registration coming soon! (1:09) Jared explains how he transitioned from sales into self-taught CNC work (2:52) Jared’s family history in manufacturing and how that shaped his path (6:34) Discovering a niche product to design and manufacture himself (10:05) The decision to make the product in-house vs. outsourcing production (12:00) How MAESTRO can simplify inspection in automated processes (17:21) Jared explains why he started with a Tormach and how he upgraded (19:12) Teaching himself CAD/CAM, the CAM learning curve, and iterative machining (24:40) Jared’s first putter design and how aesthetics vs. precision played out (26:54) Grow your top and bottom line with CliftonLarsonAllen (28:32) Naming each putter after towns tied to his grandfather (30:53) Going to market: Balancing performance with style (35:46) Manufacturing breakdown: 4 ops, soft jaws, materials, and finish choices (39:14) Challenges with scale, inventory vs. make-to-order, and a growing scrap pile (41:30) Diving into the finishing and the post-machining process (44:45) Entrepreneurship talk: bootstrapping, debt vs. investors, and capital priorities (46:37) Pricing strategy differences between product businesses and job shops (48:35) Advice for aspiring founders and a nod to the massive challenge of job shops (54:34) Why you need to subscribe to the Lights Out podcast Resources & People Mentioned Stay tuned: Top Shops 2025 registration coming soon! Grow your top and bottom line with CLA Toolpath CloudNC Connect with Jared Doerfler Hanna Golf Connect on LinkedIn [email protected] Follow on Instagram and Twitter Connect With Buy the Numbers Follow on LinkedIn Connect with Mike Payne on LinkedIn Subscribe to Buy the Numbers on Apple + Spotify Audio Production and Show Notes by - PODCAST FAST TRACK
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A deep dive into the financials of running a Manufacturing business.
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