CCEF Podcast: Where Life & Scripture Meet

Our circumstances, emotions, and relationships all shape us, but they don't define us. At the center of who we are is something deeper: the heart.

In this fourth episode of our series exploring CCEF's seven distinctives, Gunner Gundersen is joined by Jonathan Holmes and Esther Liu to discuss what we mean when we say, "Our hearts are active." Together they explore how Scripture describes the heart as the center of our desires, fears, loves, worship, and choices. How does understanding the heart change the way we pursue personal growth, care for others, and participate in the life of the local church?

The conversation moves beyond behavior modification to consider how God meets us at the deepest level of who we are. Jonathan, Esther, and Gunner share personal stories of how this distinctive has shaped their own walks with Christ and explain why curiosity, humility, and hope are essential when helping others.

In this episode, you'll learn:
• What CCEF means by "our hearts are active."
• Why biblical change is more than changing outward behavior.
• How desires, fears, and loves reveal what's happening in our hearts.
• Why understanding the heart leads to deeper relationships and wiser care.
• How this distinctive equips churches to cultivate meaningful, gospel-centered conversations.

Mentioned in this episode:

- Register for Dynamics of Biblical Change and our other courses at ccef.org/school
- Learn more about our beliefs and distinctives at ccef.org/about

Related Resources:

- "How do I know when my actions are a result of sin in my heart or because of bodily weakness?" | video by Mike Emlet

Our bodies, relationships, culture, suffering, work, spiritual battles, and life experiences all shape us in significant ways. Yet none of these influences alone defines who we are. As image bearers created by God, we are embodied souls who live before him, responding to both blessings and hardships in a world full of competing influences.

In this episode, Mike Emlet, Jonathan Holmes, and Gunner Gundersen continue CCEF's series on our seven distinctives by exploring the third distinctive:

We are embodied souls shaped by a world of influences.

Together they discuss:
Why our bodies matter for faithful care
How relationships, culture, and suffering shape our lives
Why spiritual warfare remains an important reality in counseling
The danger of reducing people to a single explanation or diagnosis
How slowing down helps us care for people more wisely
Why the local church is uniquely equipped to know, love, and walk alongside people in all their complexity
This conversation invites us to see people more fully—and to reflect the patient, compassionate care of Christ as we walk with them.

Mentioned in this episode:

- Download three free talks on anger at ccef.org/free-audio-for-anger
- Learn more about our beliefs and distinctives at ccef.org/about
- Descriptions and Prescriptions | Book by Dr. Mike Emlet

CCEF's second distinctive states: "Scripture comes from the mouth of God." But what does that mean for everyday ministry, counseling, and relationships?
In this episode, Gunner Gundersen is joined by Jonathan Holmes and Aaron Sironi to discuss how God's Word does more than provide answers—it shapes the way we listen, care, pray, discern, and walk alongside others. Together they explore how Scripture forms our priorities in counseling, helps us understand people, and serves as the lens through which we interpret both life and the world around us.
The conversation also considers the richness of Scripture's many genres—from the Psalms and Wisdom Literature to the Gospels and Song of Songs—and how each uniquely equips us to care for others. Along the way, they reflect on parenting, marriage counseling, personal devotional life, and the indispensable role of Scripture in the life of the local church.
Mentioned in this episode:
Register for our conference at ccef.org/nc26

Learn more about our video series that equips churches to wisely handle domestic abuse: ccef.org/becoming-a-refuge

Learn more about CCEF's Seven Distinctives

Listen to Part 1: "The Personal God Gets Personal with Us"

In this first episode of a new seven-part series on CCEF's distinctives, Gunner Gundersen sits down with Ed Welch and Jonathan Holmes to discuss the first distinctive: "The personal God gets personal with us."

Together, they reflect on how Scripture presents a God who draws near to his people: from the garden of Eden to the incarnation of Christ to the promised future where God will dwell with his people forever. The conversation explores how the Trinity shapes our understanding of relationships, counseling, church life, and personal ministry. These truths help churches to embody a "culture of pursuit" with warmth and hospitality as natural overflows of a real relationship with God.

The episode also introduces CCEF's broader distinctives and explains why these priorities continue to shape the ministry's counseling, teaching, and care for the church.

Mentioned in this episode:
Our latest episode of the JBC: ccef.org/jbc
Our distinctives: ccef.org/about/#distinctives

Related resource:
The Personal God | Article by David Powlison

Some of the most formative marriage counsel isn't found in a book, a technique, or a counseling session, but rather it comes from watching another couple walk faithfully with Jesus over time. 
In part two of this conversation, CCEF's Gunner Gundersen and Aaron Sironi explore Paul's surprising strategy in Philippians: imitation. Paul doesn't point to marriage principles but instead insists we keep our eyes on people who imitate Christ. 
Aaron also shares the rest of his story: how an honest "I don't know" in a conversation with a church elder launched him into biblical counseling, and what he's learned since about the deeper longings underneath many struggling marriages: Do I matter to you? Will you be there?
Listen to a rich conversation about slow formation, counter-images, and what it looks like to have a marriage worthy of the gospel.
Mentioned in this episode: Register now at ccef.org/2026 for our CCEF Annual Conference before the price increases after June 16.
Related resources:
Dynamics of Biblical Change | Online course taught by David Powlison
Speaking Truth in Marital Conflict | Blog by Lauren Whitman
On Marriage Counseling | JBC Must Reads by Aaron Sironi, Lauren Whitman, Winston Smith