The TechWolf Podcast

The world is bracing for mass unemployment, but McKinsey Global Institute researchers Sven Smit and Anu Madgavkar suggest we might actually face a labor shortage.
As agents and robots move from theory to the office floor, the real friction isn't just the tech; it's our inability to learn as fast as the machines. This episode challenges the "soft skills" myth and explains why your AI strategy will fail if it lives in the IT budget.
Timestamps
07:05 – Why 80% automation might still lead to a labor shortage.

11:50 – The "Happy AI" trap: Why adding tools isn't the same as productivity.

19:20 – The blurring lines between knowledge workers and physical labor.

22:57 – Why "Soft Skills" are a dangerous trap for the next generation.

36:53 – Tasks vs. Workflows: The secret to 80% productivity gains.

49:08 – The Budget Error: Why AI belongs in the business P&L, not IT.

It is rare to hear two leaders from the same organization move past the corporate script and into a "healthy debate" about the very foundation of their work. In this episode, Mike Manning (VP, HR Data & Innovation) and Preethi Gowda (Global People Insights Lead) from FM do exactly that. While Preethi advocates for the proactive power of layering skills with knowledge and ability , Mike challenges the "skills revolution" as a lazy proxy for understanding the actual tasks that drive revenue. They don't always agree on the terminology, but they are perfectly aligned on the outcome: if HR doesn't speak the language of the P&L, it isn't doing its job.

01:31 – The positive start: Mike and Preethi’s differing takes on a world without skills data.
08:22 – Sparring over "The Skill-Based Organization" vs. the reality of the job.
13:01 – Mike’s wake-up call: "You lost me when you called me an HR professional".
18:10 – The SIPOC Framework: A Six Sigma approach to talent.
28:15 – Case Study: How Preethi and Mike’s joint investigation saved $3M by slowing down hiring.
43:04 – The collaborative "Hard Question" for our next guest.

Most HR leaders are obsessed with "skilling" their workforce, but they’re ignoring the tasks that actually make up the work.
Josh Newman, VP of Workforce Skills at ServiceNow, argues that skills data is essentially dead weight unless it’s tied to specific business processes and AI impacts.
In this episode, Josh breaks down how ServiceNow is moving beyond simple taxonomies to create a "Talent Signature", a dynamic data layer that predicts who is ready for a promotion before they even raise their hand.

01:05 – Why AI makes HR more human, not less.

02:30 – Why redesigning HR won't be automatic and will take a "shitload of work."

04:00 – Defining the "AI-Native" organization and operationalizing intelligence.

05:25 – The "Talent Signature": Building the data layer for individual understanding.

06:30 – How ServiceNow uses intelligence to close the "Readiness Gap."

07:45 – Identifying "Forward Deployed Engineers" through capability adjacencies.

10:15 – The "Pull vs. Push" strategy: Why arbitrary skills validation fails.

12:20 – The 6-Layer Workforce Intelligence Stack (Strategy to Skills).

14:35 – Why ServiceNow chose TechWolf: The API and dynamic data layer.

16:25 – Measuring success: Infrastructure health vs. business-specific metrics.

18:50 – The next horizon: Integrating LLMs and organizational redesign.

20:15 – Josh’s question for the next guest (The Skills Skeptic).

Most organizations are pouring millions into AI tools while their actual workforce strategy remains stuck in 2010. We talk about "efficiency," but we’re failing to measure the return on investment or the impact on the people actually doing the work. In this episode, Frank and Patrick from KennedyFitch break down why the "efficiency trap" is a race to the bottom and how HR leaders must shift from managing headcounts to architecting organizational capabilities.

Timestamped Topics
01:06 – The AI Metrics Gap: Addressing whether board-level AI objectives are enterprise-wide or just "siloed in HR and IT."

03:51 – "Not yet": Frank’s direct take on why companies haven't actually updated their scorecards for the GenAI era.

06:33 – The Human Quotient: Why the return on investment (ROI) for technology is lagging behind the speed of adoption.

08:26 – The Next-Gen CHRO Search: How the leadership profile is shifting toward "digital dexterity" and strategy execution.

11:39 – Evidence-Based HR: Why the new breed of CHRO must move past being a "jack of all trades" to become a data-driven architect.

15:45 – The Skepticism Trap: Why HR leaders often reject skills data because it isn't properly contextualized with business growth.

17:54 – Cracking the SWM Nut: A systematic breakdown of Strategic Workforce Management—from demand mapping to supply analysis.

20:15 – The Demand Struggle: Why identifying "workforce demand" is the hardest part of the strategy (and why tools can't do it for you).

24:59 – Beyond Headcount: Moving the conversation from "size and FTEs" to organizational capabilities and leadership types.

29:04 – Stop Copying Benchmarks: Patrick’s warning against "social influence" and why you should build your own practice instead of testing what others do.

32:20 – "The Heat of the Moment": Why the value of an HR roadmap is only proven during a crisis or major shift, not two years later.

34:59 – Task Intelligence vs. Hype: Moving from high-level "AI will automate 20% of work" to granular, actionable employee-level data.

38:45 – The "Co-Pilot" Philosophy: Positioning AI as a partner to navigate complexity rather than a tool for simple replacement.

41:15 – The Three-Signal Filter: Balancing the Voice of the Business, the Voice of the Market, and the Voice of the Employee.

44:10 – Deducting Complexity: The final mandate for CHROs to provide vision and direction in an "intense world of complexity."

Most organizations are "dabbling" with AI while the technology's capability doubles every four months.
Jordana Kammerud (Experienced F500 CHRO) and Mik Wornoo (Co-founder, TechWolf) argue that we’ve reached a turning point: the "Oppenheimer moment" of workforce transformation, where HR must either step up as a business strategist or watch the organization succumb to the weight of outdated role-based systems.
This episode breaks down the three horizons of work intelligence and how to build a trust-based "all-access pass" to the CEO's agenda.

In this episode, we discuss:

00:00 – The Fortune 500 Perspective: Introducing Jordana Kammerud.

01:04 – Why Skills Strategies Failed (Until Now): Moving past legacy systems that "died under their own weight."

03:43 – The End of Role-Based Talent Management: Why traditional job architectures are no longer viable in 2026.

04:14 – The "Go Deep" Mandate for CHROs: Why leaders must personally master AI tools to shepherd transformation.

05:42 – Exponential Acceleration: Understanding the shift from AI doubling every 7 months to every 4 months.

07:04 – The Early Adopter Program: Co-creating the future of workforce intelligence with TechWolf.

08:23 – The "Secret Sauce" of CEO Trust: How data-driven insights solidify the CHRO-CEO bond.

12:14 – The "All-Access Pass": Defining the CHRO as a business leader first, functional expert second.

14:52 – HR’s Oppenheimer Moment: Facing the reality of 50% displacement in early careers.

18:03 – Maintaining Humanity at Scale: Balancing "synthetic empathy" with real-world human judgment.

22:09 – From Black Coffee to Million Permutations: Reimagining career pathing through a "rich tapestry" of skills.

26:15 – The Three Horizons of Work Intelligence: A tactical framework for present and future AI ROI.

30:19 – Squelching vs. Cultivating Curiosity: How to protect innovation in an automated workforce.

33:54 – The Boardroom Question: "Is the caliber of our workforce better or worse than last quarter?"

36:49 – The Closing Question: Jordana’s query for the next global HR leader.