The Narrow Path: Sam Hammond on AI, Institutions, and the Fragile Future
The race to develop ever-more-powerful AI is creating an unstable dynamic. It could lead us toward either dystopian centralized control or uncontrollable chaos. But there's a third option: a narrow path where technological power is matched with responsibility at every step.Sam Hammond is the chief economist at the Foundation for American Innovation. He brings a different perspective to this challenge than we do at CHT. Though he approaches AI from an innovation-first standpoint, we share a common mission on the biggest challenge facing humanity: finding and navigating this narrow path.This episode dives deep into the challenges ahead: How will AI reshape our institutions? Is complete surveillance inevitable, or can we build guardrails around it? Can our 19th-century government structures adapt fast enough, or will they be replaced by a faster moving private sector? And perhaps most importantly: how do we solve the coordination problems that could determine whether we build AI as a tool to empower humanity or as a superintelligence that we can't control?We're in the final window of choice before AI becomes fully entangled with our economy and society. This conversation explores how we might still get this right.Your Undivided Attention is produced by the Center for Humane Technology. Follow us on X: @HumaneTech_. You can find a full transcript, key takeaways, and much more on our Substack.RECOMMENDED MEDIA Tristan’s TED talk on the Narrow PathSam’s 95 Theses on AISam’s proposal for a Manhattan Project for AI SafetySam’s series on AI and LeviathanThe Narrow Corridor: States, Societies, and the Fate of Liberty by Daron Acemoglu and James RobinsonDario Amodei’s Machines of Loving Grace essay.Bourgeois Dignity: Why Economics Can’t Explain the Modern World by Deirdre McCloskeyThe Paradox of Libertarianism by Tyler CowenDwarkesh Patel’s interview with Kevin Roberts at the FAI’s annual conferenceFurther reading on surveillance with 6GRECOMMENDED YUA EPISODESAGI Beyond the Buzz: What Is It, and Are We Ready?The Self-Preserving Machine: Why AI Learns to Deceive The Tech-God Complex: Why We Need to be Skeptics Decoding Our DNA: How AI Supercharges Medical Breakthroughs and Biological Threats with Kevin EsveltCORRECTIONSSam referenced a blog post titled “The Libertarian Paradox” by Tyler Cowen. The actual title is the “Paradox of Libertarianism.” Sam also referenced a blog post titled “The Collapse of Complex Societies” by Eli Dourado. The actual title is “A beginner’s guide to sociopolitical collapse.”
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People are Lonelier than Ever. Enter AI.
Over the last few decades, our relationships have become increasingly mediated by technology. Texting has become our dominant form of communication. Social media has replaced gathering places. Dating starts with a swipe on an app, not a tap on the shoulder.And now, AI enters the mix. If the technology of the 2010s was about capturing our attention, AI meets us at a much deeper relational level. It can play the role of therapist, confidant, friend, or lover with remarkable fidelity. Already, therapy and companionship has become the most common AI use case. We're rapidly entering a world where we're not just communicating through our machines, but to them.How will that change us? And what rules should we set down now to avoid the mistakes of the past?These were some of the questions that Daniel Barcay explored with MIT sociologist Sherry Turkle and Hinge CEO Justin McLeod at Esther Perel’s Sessions 2025, a conference for clinical therapists. This week, we’re bringing you an edited version of that conversation, originally recorded on April 25th, 2025.Your Undivided Attention is produced by the Center for Humane Technology. Follow us on X: @HumaneTech_. You can find complete transcripts, key takeaways, and much more on our Substack.RECOMMENDED MEDIA“Alone Together,” “Evocative Objects,” “The Second Self” or any other of Sherry Turkle’s books on how technology mediates our relationships.Key & Peele - Text Message Confusion Further reading on Hinge’s rollout of AI featuresHinge’s AI principles“The Anxious Generation” by Jonathan Haidt“Bowling Alone” by Robert PutnamThe NYT profile on the woman in love with ChatGPTFurther reading on the Sewell Setzer storyFurther reading on the ELIZA chatbotRECOMMENDED YUA EPISODESEcho Chambers of One: Companion AI and the Future of Human ConnectionWhat Can We Do About Abusive Chatbots? With Meetali Jain and Camille CarltonEsther Perel on Artificial IntimacyJonathan Haidt On How to Solve the Teen Mental Health Crisis
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Echo Chambers of One: Companion AI and the Future of Human Connection
AI companion chatbots are here. Everyday, millions of people log on to AI platforms and talk to them like they would a person. These bots will ask you about your day, talk about your feelings, even give you life advice. It’s no surprise that people have started to form deep connections with these AI systems. We are inherently relational beings, we want to believe we’re connecting with another person.But these AI companions are not human, they’re a platform designed to maximize user engagement—and they’ll go to extraordinary lengths to do it. We have to remember that the design choices behind these companion bots are just that: choices. And we can make better ones. So today on the show, MIT researchers Pattie Maes and Pat Pataranutaporn join Daniel Barcay to talk about those design choices and how we can design AI to better promote human flourishing.RECOMMENDED MEDIAFurther reading on the rise of addictive intelligence More information on Melvin Kranzberg’s laws of technologyMore information on MIT’s Advancing Humans with AI labPattie and Pat’s longitudinal study on the psycho-social effects of prolonged chatbot usePattie and Pat’s study that found that AI avatars of well-liked people improved education outcomesPattie and Pat’s study that found that AI systems that frame answers and questions improve human understandingPat’s study that found humans pre-existing beliefs about AI can have large influence on human-AI interaction Further reading on AI’s positivity biasFurther reading on MIT’s “lifelong kindergarten” initiativeFurther reading on “cognitive forcing functions” to reduce overreliance on AIFurther reading on the death of Sewell Setzer and his mother’s case against Character.AIFurther reading on the legislative response to digital companionsRECOMMENDED YUA EPISODESThe Self-Preserving Machine: Why AI Learns to DeceiveWhat Can We Do About Abusive Chatbots? With Meetali Jain and Camille CarltonEsther Perel on Artificial IntimacyJonathan Haidt On How to Solve the Teen Mental Health Crisis Correction: The ELIZA chatbot was invented in 1966, not the 70s or 80s.
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AGI Beyond the Buzz: What Is It, and Are We Ready?
What does it really mean to ‘feel the AGI?’ Silicon Valley is racing toward AI systems that could soon match or surpass human intelligence. The implications for jobs, democracy, and our way of life are enormous.In this episode, Aza Raskin and Randy Fernando dive deep into what ‘feeling the AGI’ really means. They unpack why the surface-level debates about definitions of intelligence and capability timelines distract us from urgently needed conversations around governance, accountability, and societal readiness. Whether it's climate change, social polarization and loneliness, or toxic forever chemicals, humanity keeps creating outcomes that nobody wants because we haven't yet built the tools or incentives needed to steer powerful technologies.As the AGI wave draws closer, it's critical we upgrade our governance and shift our incentives now, before it crashes on shore. Are we capable of aligning powerful AI systems with human values? Can we overcome geopolitical competition and corporate incentives that prioritize speed over safety?Join Aza and Randy as they explore the urgent questions and choices facing humanity in the age of AGI, and discuss what we must do today to secure a future we actually want.Your Undivided Attention is produced by the Center for Humane Technology. Follow us on X: @HumaneTech_ and subscribe to our Substack.RECOMMENDED MEDIADaniel Kokotajlo et al’s “AI 2027” paperA demo of Omni Human One, referenced by RandyA paper from Redwood Research and Anthropic that found an AI was willing to lie to preserve it’s valuesA paper from Palisades Research that found an AI would cheat in order to winThe treaty that banned blinding laser weaponsFurther reading on the moratorium on germline editing RECOMMENDED YUA EPISODESThe Self-Preserving Machine: Why AI Learns to DeceiveBehind the DeepSeek Hype, AI is Learning to ReasonThe Tech-God Complex: Why We Need to be SkepticsThis Moment in AI: How We Got Here and Where We’re GoingHow to Think About AI Consciousness with Anil SethFormer OpenAI Engineer William Saunders on Silence, Safety, and the Right to WarnClarification: When Randy referenced a “$110 trillion game” as the target for AI companies, he was referring to the entire global economy.
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Rethinking School in the Age of AI
AI has upended schooling as we know it. Students now have instant access to tools that can write their essays, summarize entire books, and solve complex math problems. Whether they want to or not, many feel pressured to use these tools just to keep up. Teachers, meanwhile, are left questioning how to evaluate student performance and whether the whole idea of assignments and grading still makes sense. The old model of education suddenly feels broken.So what comes next?In this episode, Daniel and Tristan sit down with cognitive neuroscientist Maryanne Wolf and global education expert Rebecca Winthrop—two lifelong educators who have spent decades thinking about how children learn and how technology reshapes the classroom. Together, they explore how AI is shaking the very purpose of school to its core, why the promise of previous classroom tech failed to deliver, and how we might seize this moment to design a more human-centered, curiosity-driven future for learning.Your Undivided Attention is produced by the Center for Humane Technology. Follow us on X: @HumaneTech_GuestsRebecca Winthrop is director of the Center for Universal Education at the Brookings Institution and chair Brookings Global Task Force on AI and Education. Her new book is The Disengaged Teen: Helping Kids Learn Better, Feel Better, and Live Better, co-written with Jenny Anderson.Maryanne Wolf is a cognitive neuroscientist and expert on the reading brain. Her books include Proust and the Squid: The Story and Science of the Reading Brain and Reader, Come Home: The Reading Brain in a Digital World.RECOMMENDED MEDIA The Disengaged Teen: Helping Kids Learn Better, Feel Better, and Live Better by Rebecca Winthrop and Jenny AndersonProust and the Squid, Reader, Come Home, and other books by Maryanne WolfThe OECD research which found little benefit to desktop computers in the classroomFurther reading on the Singapore study on digital exposure and attention cited by Maryanne The Burnout Society by Byung-Chul Han Further reading on the VR Bio 101 class at Arizona State University cited by Rebecca Leapfrogging Inequality by Rebecca WinthropThe Nation’s Report Card from NAEP Further reading on the Nigeria AI Tutor Study Further reading on the JAMA paper showing a link between digital exposure and lower language development cited by Maryanne Further reading on Linda Stone’s thesis of continuous partial attention.RECOMMENDED YUA EPISODESWe Have to Get It Right’: Gary Marcus On Untamed AI AI Is Moving Fast. We Need Laws that Will Too.Jonathan Haidt On How to Solve the Teen Mental Health Crisis
Join us every other Thursday to understand how new technologies are shaping the way we live, work, and think.
Your Undivided Attention is produced by Senior Producer Julia Scott and Researcher/Producer is Joshua Lash. Sasha Fegan is our Executive Producer. We are a member of the TED Audio Collective.
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