Sustainability for Sinners

If you’re tired of talk and want real science, real debates, and real solutions — this interview cuts through the noise.

In this hard-hitting conversation, I sit down with Professor Frank Mitloehner, Ph.D., Air Quality Specialist and Professor of Animal Science at UC Davis — a scientist who’s been attacked in The New York Times and by environmental activists for his research and outspoken views on food systems and sustainability. 

Mitloehner has become a lightning rod in the debate over climate science, livestock, and the future of food — accused of bias simply for working with farmers and industry to reduce environmental impacts. Yet the investigations claiming wrongdoing find no breach of disclosure requirements, and he continues to defend his work on its merits. 

In this interview we dig into:
• Why he believes the narrative around livestock and greenhouse gases is misleading
• How scientific debate gets distorted when media prioritises clicks over context
• His quest for truth, not ideology
• Why he defends farmers and working food producers
• His critical perspective on synthetic foods & lab-grown meat hype

👉 Follow him on X/Twitter: @GHGGuru — the official handle where he shares research insights and commentary. 

📌 Featured in NY Times article “He’s an Outspoken Defender of Meat. Industry Funds His Research, Files Show” — explore more and judge for yourself. 

***Interview recorded 3rd September 2025***

In this interview, I’m joined by investigative journalist Kate Mason, a researcher and writer dedicated to examining the evolving state of democracy in Australia and critically deconstructing the narratives surrounding the Fourth Industrial Revolution (4IR).Kate’s work emerged from deep concern during the Covid years, when Australians were confronted with conflicting political messaging — calls to “return to normal” alongside promises to “Build Back Better.” Rather than accepting these slogans at face value, Kate set out to uncover what Building Back Better actually meant in practice — and who stood to benefit.Since 2021, she has rigorously analysed government and corporate policy documents, tracing the connections between public institutions, private corporations, and their collaborative bodies. Her investigations span global frameworks down to the Australian political landscape, with a particular focus on net zero agendas, technological transformation, and the policy mechanisms driving large-scale societal change.Kate’s work cuts through carefully crafted, reassuring language to examine the real-world impacts of these agendas — asking how they affect democracy, sovereignty, communities, and individual rights. Her focus is on documenting what governments and corporations are openly stating in their own plans, strategies, and partnerships.With an Honours degree in Applied Science (Social Ecology) and a long history working in community development and welfare, Kate brings both academic depth and lived, people-centred insight to her research. At the heart of her work is a deeply held belief that people have a right to full access to information about transformative policies — and a genuine voice in shaping the future being built around them.Kate argues that government and public–private partnership initiatives must be transparent, accountable, and meaningfully engage the people they affect, rather than being driven by technocratic processes removed from democratic scrutiny.In this conversation, we explore democracy, net zero policies, the Fourth Industrial Revolution, and the societal consequences of top-down transformation, asking who decides, who benefits, and what these agendas mean for the future of civic life in Australia and beyond.*Also, just a minor correction regarding Kate's comment that Australia's energy is privatised - she has clarified that some states have privatised energy, others (including the Northern Territory) are public and some are a mixture of both public and private.Where to Find Kate’s WorkWebsite / Research Hub:https://www.katemasonresearch.com.au/YouTube:https://www.youtube.com/channel/UChK4hnsPQX40yx-IslLFqdgSubstack:https://kate739.substack.com/Rumble:https://rumble.com/user/katemasonIMOP

Peter Byck is an award-winning documentary filmmaker and professor of practise at Arizona State University, where he teaches in both the School of Sustainability and the Walter Cronkite School of Journalism. He is best known for using film to explore urgent environmental issues through engaging, human-centred storytelling.

Peter directed and produced the acclaimed documentaries Carbon Nation, Garbage, Carbon Cowboys, and more recently, the four-part series *Roots So Deep (You Can See the Devil Down There).

His work bridges science, policy, and storytelling, often bringing together diverse voices to find common ground.

Through his films, Peter invites audiences to not just see the problems, but also the potential solutions rooted in collaboration, innovation, and care for the land.

*Roots So Deep is a $10 million research project comparing Adaptive Multi-Paddock (AMP) grazing with conventional grazing; collaborating with 20 scientists and 10 farm families, focused on soil health & soil carbon storage, microbial/bug/bird biodiversity, water cycling and much more.

🔗 Connect with Peter -
Documentary: 4-part series - Roots So Deep (You Can See the Devil Down There) at its official site here https://rootssodeep.uscreen.io (THIS REALLY IS A 'MUST SEE'!!)

New Podcast!: The Peter Byck Show

Instagram / Facebook / TikTok: @carboncowboys

X/Twitter: @peterbyck

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🌍 Welcome! I’m on a mission to explore real-world solutions to global sustainability—with honesty, hope, curiosity, and a bit of dark humour. 😅
🎙️ Interviews with FARMERS, SCIENTISTS, AUTHORS & ACTIVISTS—plus original content showing what sustainable living can look like. No preaching. No perfection. Just real talk. Sustainability for the many, not the few.

🍽️ From HEALTHY FOOD to CLEAN WATER and DETOXING YOUR LIFE —this channel breaks it all down so you can live healthier, happier, and smarter. There's something for everyone here on the channel!✌️😎💡This is sustainability without judgment. I certainly ain't no saint, and I don’t expect you to be either!

🇮🇪Based in Ireland. Thinking globally.🌎
MY LIFE: FARMING (helping my uncle)
👨‍🌾🐮20 year VEGETARIAN, now I eat a healthy mix of ALL FOODS 🥩🥦🍳
MSc. in SUSTAINABLE ENVIRONMENTS 🌿
FORMER SUSTAINABILITY CONSULTANT
FORMER INVESTMENT MANAGER 💰
Hon. Degree in REAL ESTATE 🏘️
GERMAN/IRISH ☘️
🔔 Subscribe & join the wild journey!😆🤪

LINKS📸
Instagram: [@sustainabilityforsinners] (https://www.instagram.com/sustainabilityforsinners)
🎵 TikTok: [@sustainabilityforsinners](https://www.tiktok.com/@sustainabilityforsinners)
🎧 Spotify: [sustainabilityforsinners](https://open.spotify.com/show/sustainabilityforsinners)
🍏 Apple Podcasts: [sustainabilityforsinners](https://podcasts.apple.com/sustainabilityforsinners)
👤 About Me: [sustainabilityforsinners](https://about.me/sustainabilityforsinners)
🕊️ X (Twitter): [@sustain4sinners](https://x.com/@sustain4sinners)

I had an engaging and thought-provoking conversation with Prof. Frédéric Leroy, a leading scholar in food science and biotechnology, about the future of sustainable food systems and the pivotal role livestock still plays.

We explored the tensions between aggressive climate and food policies, the push for plant-based diets, and the narratives promoted by groups such as the World Economic Forum and some environmentalist movements that envision a future without animals on the land.

Prof. Leroy shared insights into the promises and pitfalls of lab-based meat and precision fermentation, emphasising the nuanced realities and limitations that are often glossed over by high-level idealism.

Our discussion also touched on how these agendas intersect with predatory capitalism, the erosion of essential rights and freedoms, and what practical steps we can take to protect food sovereignty.

We delved into the Dublin Declaration, which highlights the irreplaceable value of livestock in global food systems, both nutritionally and culturally.This was not only an interview about science and policy, but also about values, freedom, and the future we want to shape together.

🔗 Links & Profiles
🕊️ X (Twitter): @fleroy1974
- Academic Profile (VUB – Research Portal):
https://researchportal.vub.be/en/persons/frederic-leroy
- Academic Profile (IMDO Faculty Page):
https://imdo.research.vub.be/en/prof-dr-ir-frederic-leroy
- ALEPH 2020 – Expert Profile:
https://www.aleph2020.org/experts/leroy-frederic
- EAAP Leroy Award 2022:
https://eaap.org/eaap-leroy-award-2022-to-prof-frederic-leroy/
- AMSA International Lectureship Award 2025:
https://meatscience.org/press/article/2025/03/14/renowned-food-scientist-fr%C3%A9d%C3%A9ric-leroy-announced-as-the-amsa-2025-international-lectureship-award-winner
- The Conversation – Author Page:
https://theconversation.com/profiles/frederic-leroy-659117Google Scholar:
https://scholar.google.com/citations?user=tGuav7wAAAAJ

- ResearchGate:
https://www.researchgate.net/profile/Frederic-Leroy

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🌍 Welcome! I’m on a mission to explore real-world solutions to global sustainability—with honesty, hope, curiosity, and a bit of dark humour. 😅🎙️ Interviews with FARMERS, SCIENTISTS, AUTHORS & ACTIVISTS—plus original content showing what sustainable living can look like. No preaching. No perfection. Just real talk. Sustainability for the many, not the few.🍽️ From HEALTHY FOOD to CLEAN WATER and DETOXING YOUR LIFE —this channel breaks it all down so you can live healthier, happier, and smarter. There's something for everyone here on the channel!✌️😎💡This is sustainability WITHOUT JUDGEMENT. I'm certainly no saint, and I don’t expect you to be either!💥🍀🇮🇪Based in Ireland. Thinking globally.🌎MY LIFE: Former SUSTAINABILITY CONSULTANT 🌍⚡🏠Former INVESTMENT MANAGER 💵📈💸MSc. in SUSTAINABLE ENVIRONMENTS 🌿🌲♻️🚮Hons BSc. Degree in REAL ESTATE 🏘️🏠FARMING (helping my uncle) 👨‍🌾🐮🥩Former VEGETARIAN (20 yrs) 🥩🥦🍳🔔 Subscribe & join the wild journey!😆🤪 LINKS📸 Instagram: [@sustainabilityforsinners] (https://www.instagram.com/sustainabilityforsinners) 🎵 TikTok: [@sustainabilityforsinners](https://www.tiktok.com/@sustainabilityforsinners) 🎧 Spotify: [sustainabilityforsinners](https://open.spotify.com/show/sustainabilityforsinners) 🍏 Apple Podcasts: [sustainabilityforsinners](https://podcasts.apple.com/sustainabilityforsinners) 👤 About Me: [sustainabilityforsinners](https://about.me/sustainabilityforsinners)🕊️ X (Twitter): [@sustain4sinners](https://x.com/@sustain4sinners)

Elze van Hamelen is a Dutch investigative journalist whose work examines the power structures shaping agriculture, energy, and society.

With a background in corporate sustainability consulting (MA, MBA), she shifted into independent research and writing to focus on how financial, political, and technological systems intersect with food, farming, and freedom.

Her investigations explore topics such as the rise of “pharma food” and cellular agriculture, the impacts of industrial wind energy, UN and EU land-use policy, and the pressures facing Dutch farmers and fishermen. Through her reporting, she highlights the often unseen connections between global governance and everyday life — always drawing from documents, funding flows, and institutional analysis.Elze publishes in outlets including De Andere Krant and on her own Substack, where she shares articles, essays, and in-depth interviews.

She is widely recognised for her ability to connect high-level policy to its real-world consequences for communities on the ground.

📌 Selected Works / Focus Areas
- Pharma Food — critical reporting on lab-grown meat and cellular agriculture.
- The Wind Energy Racket — investigations into the externalities and hidden costs of industrial wind energy.
- Land & Food Policy — analyses of UN and EU strategies that affect farmland, fisheries, and local communities.
- Dutch Farmers & Fishermen — documentation of protests, policy impacts, and the broader battle over food sovereignty.
- Lawfare & Free Expression — reporting on legal and institutional pressures against journalists, writers, and dissidents.

🔗 Connect with Elze -
🌐 Website: vanhamelen.eu
🌐 Substack: Elze’s Investigations
📱 Twitter: @ElzevH

****

🌍 Welcome! I’m on a mission to explore real-world solutions to global sustainability—with honesty, hope, curiosity, and a bit of dark humour. 😅

🎙️ Interviews with FARMERS, SCIENTISTS, AUTHORS & ACTIVISTS—plus original content showing what sustainable living can look like. No preaching. No perfection. Just real talk. Sustainability for the many, not the few.

🍽️ From HEALTHY FOOD to CLEAN WATER and DETOXING YOUR LIFE —this channel breaks it all down so you can live healthier, happier, and smarter. There's something for everyone here on the channel!✌️😎💡
This is sustainability WITHOUT JUDGEMENT. I'm certainly no saint, and I don’t expect you to be either!💥
🍀🇮🇪Based in Ireland. Thinking globally.🌎

MY LIFE:
Former SUSTAINABILITY CONSULTANT 🌍⚡🏠
Former INVESTMENT MANAGER 💵📈💸
MSc. in SUSTAINABLE ENVIRONMENTS 🌿🌲♻️🚮
Hons BSc. Degree in REAL ESTATE 🏘️🏠
FARMING (helping my uncle) 👨‍🌾🐮🥩
Former VEGETARIAN (20 yrs) 🥩🥦🍳🔔
Subscribe & join the wild journey!😆🤪

LINKS
📸 Instagram: [@sustainabilityforsinners] (https://www.instagram.com/sustainabilityforsinners)
🎵 TikTok: [@sustainabilityforsinners](https://www.tiktok.com/@sustainabilityforsinners)
🎧 Spotify: [sustainabilityforsinners](https://open.spotify.com/show/sustainabilityforsinners)
🍏 Apple Podcasts: [sustainabilityforsinners](https://podcasts.apple.com/sustainabilityforsinners)
👤 About Me: [sustainabilityforsinners](https://about.me/sustainabilityforsinners)
🕊️ X (Twitter): [@sustain4sinners](https://x.com/@sustain4sinners)