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The Other 22 Hours

Michaela Anne, Aaron Shafer-Haiss
The Other 22 Hours
Latest episode

164 episodes

  • The Other 22 Hours

    Rodney Crowell on letting go of recognition, 40-year songs, and talking to trees.

    19/08/2026 | 55 mins.
    With two Grammy Awards, 15 number-one singles, and a songwriting catalog recorded by legends like Emmylou Harris, Bob Seger, and Waylon Jennings, Nashville Songwriters Hall of Fame member Rodney Crowell stands as one of Americana's most enduring icons. Yet, after 50 years in Nashville, Rodney’s relationship to his craft is grounded not in recognition, but in the quiet, daily act of showing up.
    In this conversation from 2023, Rodney reflects on the early years of roaming Nashville alongside Guy Clark and Townes Van Zandt to evolving past the need for applause, the spiritual discipline of 7-day vision quests, and why a song can take 40 years to finally tell you what it wants to be.
    In This Episode:
    Rodney Crowell
    Jedd Hughes
    Marty Stuart
    JD Miller's Recording Studio
    Wilburn Brothers
    Emmylou Harris
    Guy Clark
    Mickey Newbury
    Bob Seger

    Go Deeper:
    Watch: View this entire conversation on YouTube.
    Explore: Find similar conversations in these themed playlists.
    Connect: Join the conversation on Instagram.

    The Hosts:
    The Other 22 Hours is hosted by Aaron Shafer-Haiss (Producer/Mixer) and Michaela Anne (Songwriter/Creative Coach).
    More about Aaron’s work.
    More about Michaela Anne’s work.

    Credits: 
    Produced by Aaron Shafer-Haiss. Original music written, performed and produced by Aaron Shafer-Haiss. Part of the Bluegrass Situation Podcast Network.
  • The Other 22 Hours

    Mary Gauthier on the business mindset of an artist, art as recovery, and owning a clam shack.

    12/08/2026 | 47 mins.
    GRAMMY-nominated songwriter and author Mary Gauthier, whose songs have been recorded by everyone from Tim McGraw and Blake Shelton to Boy George and Jimmy Buffett, joins us for a deeply resonant exploration of life, survival, and craft. Starting her songwriting journey at age 40 after a successful career as a chef and restaurant owner, Mary offers a deeply grounded perspective on what it means to build a long-haul artistic life.
    Originally aired in August 2023 as Episode 27, we are revisiting this favorite conversation from our archive to unpack her 33-year journey in recovery, the necessity of patience in art and persistence in business, and how songwriting serves as a container for processing trauma and bridging human divides.
    In This Episode:
    Mary Gauthier
    Songwriting With Soldiers 
    'Saved by a Song: The Art and Healing Power of Songwriting'
    Ep 152 - Matraca Berg
    Ep 43 - Gretchen Peters
    Beth Nielsen Chapman
    Liz Rose
    Patty Griffin
    Neko Case

    Go Deeper:
    Watch: View this entire conversation on YouTube.
    Explore: Find similar conversations in these themed playlists.
    Connect: Join the conversation on Instagram.
    The Hosts:
    The Other 22 Hours is hosted by Aaron Shafer-Haiss (Producer/Mixer) and Michaela Anne (Songwriter/Creative Coach).
    More about Aaron’s work.
    More about Michaela Anne’s work.
    Credits: 
    Produced by Aaron Shafer-Haiss. Original music written, performed and produced by Aaron Shafer-Haiss. Part of the Bluegrass Situation Podcast Network.
  • The Other 22 Hours

    Ruby Amanfu on guarding your creative energy force field, the illusion of major-label financials, and cooking dinner for Willie Nelson.

    05/08/2026 | 44 mins.
    This week, we dive into our archives for this special reissue of our conversation with GRAMMY-nominated singer-songwriter, producer, activist, and chef Ruby Amanfu. Known for her profound collaborations with H.E.R., Brandi Carlile, Alicia Keys, and Beyoncé, Ruby has navigated the highest peaks of the music industry while fiercely protecting her inner peace. In this episode, we explore the structural collisions that force us to speak our truth, the reality of reclaiming your identity outside of financial validation, and what happens when we finally release our death grip on how we thought our lives would look.
    In This Episode:
    Ruby Amanfu
    Sam and Ruby
    Porter’s Call
    Andy Little
    MusiCares
    Lee Ann Womack
    Willie Nelson
    Love Rising Concert

    Go Deeper:
    Watch: View this entire conversation on YouTube.
    Explore: Find similar conversations in these themed playlists.
    Connect: Join the conversation on Instagram.
    The Hosts:
    The Other 22 Hours is hosted by Aaron Shafer-Haiss (Producer/Mixer) and Michaela Anne (Songwriter/Creative Coach).
    More about Aaron’s work.
    More about Michaela Anne’s work.
    Credits: 
    Produced by Aaron Shafer-Haiss. Original music written, performed and produced by Aaron Shafer-Haiss. Part of the Bluegrass Situation Podcast Network.
  • The Other 22 Hours

    Yancey Strickler on artist power, interdependent networks, and a zip file worth thousands.

    29/07/2026 | 51 mins.
    What happens when creative people stop looking for a seat at the table and build a table of their own? For generations society has treated an artist's life as an economic sideline, a romanticized piecemeal struggle. Today, we are witnessing a structural revolution. With Colorado recently passing the nation's first Artist Corporation legislation (the Colorado Artist Company Act) in June 2026, we are reissuing our definitive conversation with the architect of that very movement, Yancey Strickler.
    As the co-founder of Kickstarter, Metalabel, and the Artist Corporations Foundation, Yancey has dedicated his life to equipping creators with the structural tools to act as real entrepreneurs. In this expansive conversation, we trace the line between blue-collar artistry and private equity, explore why the industry trades meaning for convenience, and look closely at how interdependent networks can finally break the cycle of artistic exploitation.
    In This Episode:
    Yancey Strickler
    A-Corps
    Colorado Legislation, June 2026
    MetaLabel
    The Creative Independent
    Hipgnosis
    Nirvana
    The Royal Alberta Advantage
    Ep 68 - Evan Honer
    “All The King’s Men”
    Virgil Abloh
    Bentoism
    CS Lewis - “The Inner Ring”

    Go Deeper:
    Watch: View this entire conversation on YouTube.
    Explore: Find similar conversations in these themed playlists.
    Connect: Join the conversation on Instagram.
    The Hosts:
    The Other 22 Hours is hosted by Aaron Shafer-Haiss (Producer/Mixer) and Michaela Anne (Songwriter/Creative Coach).
    More about Aaron’s work.
    More about Michaela Anne’s work.
    Credits: 
    Produced by Aaron Shafer-Haiss. Original music written, performed and produced by Aaron Shafer-Haiss. Part of the Bluegrass Situation Podcast Network.
  • The Other 22 Hours

    Hrishikesh Hirway on creative wholeness, strategic dilettantism, and surrendering to sandpaper.

    22/07/2026 | 48 mins.
    We often treat our creative identities like lanes, fearing that branching out looks like simple dilettantism. This week, we explore the delicate balance of identity and creative output with singer-songwriter Hrishikesh Hirway, the brilliant mind behind hit podcasts The West Wing Weekly and Home Cooking, as well as the globally-acclaimed Netflix series and podcast 'Song Exploder,' which features the likes of Paul McCartney, Billie Eilish, REM, and Lin-Manuel Miranda.
    Despite a decade of monumental success in the podcast and broadcast worlds, Hrishikesh found himself battling a quiet, profound depression born from leaving his primary identity as a singer-songwriter behind. He recently returned to music with his first album in 15 years and joins us for a beautifully tender conversation on breaking through a 10-year writer's block, navigating the vulnerability of cold-calling collaborators, and learning to sit comfortably within a "queer divine dissatisfaction."
    In This Episode:
    Hrishikesh Hirway
    Song Exploder (Podcast / Netflix Series)
    Alison Russell
    Linda Ronstadt
    Talking Heads
    The Band
    The Grateful Dead
    Bob Dylan
    Phil Weinrobe
    Ep 117 - Maia Friedman
    Jeff Tweedy - How to Write One Song (Book)
    Carl Jung / Depth Psychology
    The West Wing Weekly (Podcast)
    Home Cooking (Podcast)
    Samin Nosrat
    Salt, Fat, Acid, Heat (Book)
    Josh Malina
    Allison Janney
    Jenny Owen Youngs
    Yep Roc Records
    John Mark Nelson
    Matt Ross Spang (Memphis TED Talk)
    Agnes de Mille
    Martha Graham

    Go Deeper:
    Watch: View this entire conversation on YouTube.
    Explore: Find similar conversations in these themed playlists.
    Connect: Join the conversation on Instagram.

    The Hosts:
    The Other 22 Hours is hosted by Aaron Shafer-Haiss (Producer/Mixer) and Michaela Anne (Songwriter/Creative Coach).
    More about Aaron’s work.
    More about Michaela Anne’s work.
    
    Credits: 
    Produced by Aaron Shafer-Haiss. Original music written, performed and produced by Aaron Shafer-Haiss. Part of the Bluegrass Situation Podcast Network.
More Arts podcasts
About The Other 22 Hours
An exploration of the creative life, lived in the in-between.A sanctuary for the creative spirit in a results-obsessed world.Moving beyond the highlight reel, hosts and working musicians Aaron Shafer-Haiss and Michaela Anne facilitate intimate, artist-to-artist conversations with renowned musicians, authors, visual artists and actors about the grit required to sustain a life in the arts. From navigating doubt to finding stillness, this is the reality of the work. Unfiltered.
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