The Library of Lazy Thinking Podcast

Are you fucking with me?
Yes.
Great. I thought so.
It might sound negative, but it’s actually a sign of huge respect. Possibly the most intimate secret dialogue a reader can have with a writer.
It’s a dialogue that arises on numerous occasions when reading Jo Lloyd’s work, and it’s a dialogue my guest and I both experienced positively in reading this inventive and immersive collection of short stories.
Indeed, welcome to The Library of Lazy Thinking Podcast, with me, your host, Glenn Fisher.
As you may know by now, in each episode, I'm joined by a guest from the world of books and culture to talk about a specific book they'd like to put in the library.
There's no plan and no agenda, just two people lazily thinking about literature.
If you enjoy the show and would like to help us (and get your hands on a coveted Library of Lazy Thinking bookmark, tote bag, and pin badge), you can become a supporter of the library by upgrading to a paid subscription.
But either way, please do like and share the show—it all helps.
In this episode, my very special guest is the writer and artist Adrian Duncan, whose latest novel, A Thought Without Collision, is published by Tuskar Press. We discuss his pick for the library, the 2021 short story collection The Earth, Thy Great Exchequer, Ready Lies by Jo Lloyd.
About Adrian Duncan
Adrian Duncan’s debut novel Love Notes from a German Building Site won the 2019 John McGahern Book Prize. His second novel A Sabbatical in Leipzig was shortlisted for the Kerry Group Irish Novel of the Year Award 2020 and was republished in the UK in late 2022 with Colm Tóibín and Peter Straus’ Tuskar Rock Press. His collection of short stories Midfield Dynamo was published in March 2021 and was longlisted for the Edge Hill Prize. His third novel, The Geometer Lobachevsky, published in April 2022, was shortlisted for the Walter Scott Prize and the Kerry Group Irish Novel of the Year. His fourth novel, The Gorgeous Inertia of the Earth, was published to critical acclaim in January of 2025 by Tuskar Rock Press, and his fifth, A Thought without Collision, was published in August 2026.
About Jo Lloyd
Jo Lloyd won the BBC National Short Story Award in 2019 and an O. Henry Prize in 2018. Her stories have appeared in Zoetrope: All-Story, Ploughshares, Southern Review, and elsewhere. The Earth, Thy Great Exchequer, Ready Lies is her first collection. She grew up in South Wales, where she now lives.
Links to obscure (and not so obscure) things mentioned in this episode
* Order The Earth, Thy Great Exchequer, Ready Lies by Jo Lloyd and A Thought Without Collision by Adrian Duncan from my local independent bookshop in Sheffield here.
* Find Adrian Duncan on Instagram here.
* Find Glenn Fisher on Instagram here.
* Find The Library of Lazy Thinking on Instagram here.
About the Library
The Library of Lazy Thinking is a place to hang out and learn more about books. If you’d like to support the library and get access to everything here, you can become a paid member (and get an exclusive The Library of Lazy Thinking bookmark, sticker, and pin badge). All support goes back into the library, helping to organize live events, exclusive merchandise, and more podcasts.
About Glenn Fisher
Glenn Fisher is a writer—wait, Glenn Fisher is me. I’m the one writing this. Let’s drop the third-person act. My writing has been published in Lunate, The Paris Bitter Hearts Pit, 3am Magazine, Dogmatika, and Litro Magazine. I write about books and interview other writers and artists here in The Library of Lazy Thinking. I live in Sheffield and work as a freelance copywriter. I have had a best-selling non-fiction book published on the subject called The Art of the Click. It was published by Harriman House and shortlisted for Business Book of the Year. It has been translated into Simplified Chinese and Korean. I also have a dog called Pablo. He is harder to translate. Indeed, most of my life revolves around trying to understand his often unreasonable demands. Meanwhile, I am currently working on my debut novel, The Invention of Memory, and on the eternal, soul-destroying task of finding an agent.



Get full access to The Library of Lazy Thinking at lazythinking.substack.com/subscribe

In an increasingly paranoid and isolating age, empathy seems in short supply.
Even when we say we empathize, how much do we actually listen to the nuance of someone else’s experience, especially if it jars with our own? Are we even capable of truly listening to others when we so often seem entirely incapable of listening to ourselves?
These challenging questions are at the heart of the fascinating yet relatively unknown novel, Empathy, which is the focus for this episode of the show.
Thankfully, given my own skills in the active listening department have in the past been found severely lacking, I’m joined by the brilliant Ellie O’Neill to guide me somewhere towards a greater understanding of such things.
Indeed, welcome to The Library of Lazy Thinking Podcast, with me, your host, Glenn Fisher.
As you may know by now, in each episode, I'm joined by a guest from the world of books and culture to talk about a specific book they'd like to put in the library.
There's no plan and no agenda, just two people lazily thinking about literature.
If you enjoy the show and would like to help us (and get your hands on a coveted Library of Lazy Thinking bookmark, tote bag, and pin badge), you can become a supporter of the library by upgrading to a paid subscription.
But either way, please do like and share the show—it all helps.
In this episode, as I say, my very special guest is the musician, Ellie O’Niell, whose debut album, Time of Fallow, is released on St.Itch Records. We discuss her pick for the library, the 1992 novel Empathy by Sarah Schulman.
About Ellie O’Neill
Ellie O’Neill is an artist from Co. Meath, Ireland, whose music weaves a rich, diverse and tender landscape traversing raw, intuitive explorations of intimacy and loss, friendship and queer identity. Her debut record, Time of Fallow, is released on St.Itch Records.
About Sarah Schulman
Sarah Schulman is an acclaimed American novelist, playwright, nonfiction writer, and AIDS historian. Based in New York City, she is a Distinguished Professor of Humanities at the College of Staten Island. Known for her decades of LGBTQ+ activism, she co-directed the ACT UP Oral History Project and has authored over 20 books, including The Gentrification of the Mind and Let the Record Show.
Links to obscure (and not so obscure) things mentioned in this episode
* Order Empathy by Sarah Schulman from my local independent bookshop in Sheffield here.
* Listen to Ellie’s great new record on Spotify here and pick up a physical copy of the record here.
* Find Ellie O’Neill on Instagram here.
* Find Glenn Fisher on Instagram here.
* Find The Library of Lazy Thinking on Instagram here.
About the Library
The Library of Lazy Thinking is a place to hang out and learn more about books. If you’d like to support the library and get access to everything here, you can become a paid member (and get an exclusive The Library of Lazy Thinking bookmark, sticker, and pin badge). All support goes back into the library, helping to organize live events, exclusive merchandise, and more podcasts.
About Glenn Fisher
Glenn Fisher is a writer—wait, Glenn Fisher is me. I’m the one writing this. Let’s drop the third-person act. My writing has been published in Lunate, The Paris Bitter Hearts Pit, 3am Magazine, Dogmatika, and Litro Magazine. I write about books and interview other writers and artists here in The Library of Lazy Thinking. I live in Sheffield and work as a freelance copywriter. I have had a best-selling non-fiction book published on the subject called The Art of the Click. It was published by Harriman House and shortlisted for Business Book of the Year. It has been translated into Simplified Chinese and Korean. I also have a dog called Pablo. He is harder to translate. Indeed, most of my life revolves around trying to understand his often unreasonable demands. Meanwhile, I am currently working on my debut novel, The Invention of Memory, and on the eternal, soul-destroying task of finding an agent.



Get full access to The Library of Lazy Thinking at lazythinking.substack.com/subscribe

He does warn you.
But still.
Despite the opening line telling you things aren’t going to end well, something about the way The Easter Parade tangles you up in the lives of the two Grimes sisters means that by the end you’re both surprised and entirely accepting of their bleak fate.
And despite the bleakness, it’s pretty damn brilliant.
It’s an opinion shared by my excellent guest for this episode of the show, literary man of the moment, Jem Calder. As he points out, there’s a lot of Yates in his own much-acclaimed debut novel, which is likely one of the reasons Sally Rooney is a big fan.
We explore why The Easter Parade works so well, how it influenced Jem’s own writing, and we dig into the strangely joy-inspiring concept of depressive realism.
Indeed, welcome to The Library of Lazy Thinking Podcast, with me, your host, Glenn Fisher.
As you may know by now, in each episode, I'm joined by a guest from the world of books and culture to talk about a specific book they'd like to put in the library.
There's no plan and no agenda, just two people lazily thinking about literature.
If you enjoy the show and would like to help us (and get your hands on a coveted Library of Lazy Thinking bookmark, tote bag, and pin badge), you can become a supporter of the library by upgrading to a paid subscription.
But either way, please do like and share the show—it all helps.
In this episode, as I say, my very special guest is the writer, Jem Calder, whose debut novel, I Want You To Be Happy, was published in the UK by Faber. We discuss his pick for the library, the 1976 novel The Easter Parade by Richard Yates.
About Jem Calder
Jem Calder was born in Cambridge but lives and works in London. His fiction has been published in The Stinging Fly and Granta, and his debut short story collection, Reward System, was published by Faber in 2022. His debut novel, I Want You To Be Happy, was published by Faber in 2026.
About Richard Yates
Richard Yates was born in 1926 in New York and lived in California. His prize-winning stories began to appear in 1953, and his first novel, Revolutionary Road, was nominated for the National Book Award in 1961. He is the author of eight other works, including the novels A Good School, The Easter Parade, and Disturbing the Peace, as well as two collections of short stories, Eleven Kinds of Loneliness and Liars in Love. He died in 1992.
Links to obscure (and not so obscure) things mentioned in this episode
* Order The Easter Parade by Richard Yates, and I Want You To Be Happy by Jem Calder from my local independent bookshop in Sheffield here.
* Read an interview with Jem about his new novel in Dazed here.
* Find Glenn Fisher on Instagram here.
* Find The Library of Lazy Thinking on Instagram here.
About the Library
The Library of Lazy Thinking is a place to hang out and learn more about books. If you’d like to support the library and get access to everything here, you can become a paid member (and get an exclusive The Library of Lazy Thinking bookmark, sticker, and pin badge). All support goes back into the library, helping to organize live events, exclusive merchandise, and more podcasts.
About Glenn Fisher
Glenn Fisher is a writer—wait, Glenn Fisher is me. I’m the one writing this. Let’s drop the third-person act. My writing has been published in Lunate, The Paris Bitter Hearts Pit, 3am Magazine, Dogmatika, and Litro Magazine. I write about books and interview other writers and artists here in The Library of Lazy Thinking. I live in Sheffield and work as a freelance copywriter. I have had a best-selling non-fiction book published on the subject called The Art of the Click. It was published by Harriman House and shortlisted for Business Book of the Year. It has been translated into Simplified Chinese and Korean. I also have a dog called Pablo. He is harder to translate. Indeed, most of my life revolves around trying to understand his often unreasonable demands. Meanwhile, I am currently working on my debut novel, The Invention of Memory, and on the eternal, soul-destroying task of finding an agent.



Get full access to The Library of Lazy Thinking at lazythinking.substack.com/subscribe

Is it instinctive?
The first time, as a young writer or reader, when you discover short stories published in The New Yorker, and you know you’ve finally stumbled across the good shit.
When you realise all the greats have contributed at some point. Salinger and Saunders. Rushdie and Roth. Ernaux and Ishiguro. Not to mention Truman Capote, John Updike, and Zadie Smith.
Maybe you always knew. Maybe you saw someone cool with a folded copy artfully poking out from their sports coat pocket. Maybe you heard it referenced in a film. Or maybe it’s just innate, maybe you’re just born with knowledge of The New Yorker—the literary equivalent of Maybelline.
Either way, chances are you do indeed know The New Yorker, and you know that the short stories it features are pretty good.
What you might not know is that my brilliant guest for this episode of the show has herself had a (very good) short story published in the prestigious pages of the magazine.
So, she makes for the ideal guest to discuss New Yorker Short Stories in general.
Indeed, welcome to The Library of Lazy Thinking Podcast, with me, your host, Glenn Fisher.
As you may know by now, in each episode, I'm joined by a guest from the world of books and culture to talk about a specific book they'd like to put in the library.
There's no plan and no agenda, just two people lazily thinking about literature.
If you enjoy the show and would like to help us (and get your hands on a coveted Library of Lazy Thinking bookmark, sticker, and pin badge), you can become a supporter of the library by upgrading to a paid subscription.
But either way, please do like and share the show—it all helps.
In this episode, my very special guest is the writer, Molly Aitken, whose most recent novel Bright I Burn is published in the UK by Canongate. We discuss her pick for the library, the short stories of The New Yorker, with a specific focus on The Lottery by Shirley Jackson, Leopard by Wells Tower, and In the Middle of the Fields by Mary Lavin.
About Molly
Molly Aitken is the author of Bright I Burn, a Royal Society of Literature Encore Prize shortlisted novel, and The Island Child. Her prize-winning short fiction has been published in The New Yorker and Ploughshares.
About The New Yorker
The New Yorker is an American magazine featuring journalism, commentary, criticism, essays, fiction, satire, cartoons, and poetry. It was founded on February 21, 1925, by Harold Ross and his wife, Jane Grant, a reporter for The New York Times. It is arguably the most prestigious publisher of short fiction in the world. Famous contributors range from legends like J.D. Salinger and Vladimir Nabokov to contemporary heavyweights like George Saunders and Jhumpa Lahiri.
Links to obscure (and not so obscure) things mentioned in this episode
* Order A Century of Fiction by The New Yorker and Bright I Burn by Molly Aitken from my local independent bookshop in Sheffield here.
* Find Molly Aitken on Instagram here.
* Read Molly’s story in The New Yorker here.
* Find Glenn Fisher on Instagram here.
* Find The Library of Lazy Thinking on Instagram here.
About the Library
The Library of Lazy Thinking is a place to hang out and learn more about books. If you’d like to support the library and get access to everything here, you can become a paid member (and get an exclusive The Library of Lazy Thinking bookmark, sticker, and pin badge). All support goes back into the library, helping to organize live events, exclusive merchandise, and more podcasts.
About Glenn
Glenn Fisher is a writer—wait, Glenn Fisher is me. I’m the one writing this. Let’s drop the third-person act. My writing has been published in Lunate, The Paris Bitter Hearts Pit, 3am Magazine, Dogmatika, and Litro Magazine. I write about books and interview other writers and artists here in The Library of Lazy Thinking. I live in Sheffield and work as a freelance copywriter. I have had a best-selling non-fiction book published on the subject called The Art of the Click. It was published by Harriman House and shortlisted for Business Book of the Year. It has been translated into Simplified Chinese and Korean. I also have a dog called Pablo. He is harder to translate. Indeed, most of my life revolves around trying to understand his often unreasonable demands. Meanwhile, I am currently working on my first novel, The Invention of Memory, and on the eternal, soul-destroying task of finding an agent.



Get full access to The Library of Lazy Thinking at lazythinking.substack.com/subscribe

There’s a common misconception, especially in the South, that all Northern Men are bitter and grumpy, and that we generally sit around drinking too much tea.
This is not true.
But to prevent any members of the London elite from having their worlds shattered, in this episode, my guest and I subvert the very concept of autofiction and use various meta tactics to make you THINK we are bitter and grumpy and generally drink too much tea.
Thank us later.
In reality, we both ride white horses, drink only Château Margaux, and when sending our witty hand-written correspondence to French pen pals, at the local Post Office, we’ll often be heard reciting Proust. But still, to double down on the necessary illusion, in this same episode, we pretend to be bitter and grumpy men by discussing a book about a fictional man who is also bitter and grumpy, which was, in turn, written by a bitter and grumpy man who does exist.
There are many layers. But I trust you, dear listener.
Indeed, welcome to The Library of Lazy Thinking Podcast, with me, your host, Glenn Fisher.
As you may know by now, in each episode, I'm joined by a guest from the world of books and culture to talk about a specific book they'd like to put in the library.
There's no plan and no agenda, just two people lazily thinking about literature.
If you enjoy the show and would like to help us (and get your hands on a coveted Library of Lazy Thinking bookmark, sticker, and pin badge), you can become a supporter of the library by upgrading to a paid subscription.
But either way, please do like and share the show—it all helps.
In this episode, my very special guest is the writer, Shaun Wilson, whose book Malc’s Boy is published in the UK by Conduit Press. We discuss his pick for the library, the 2025 novel Service by John Tottenham.
About Shaun
Shaun Wilson was born in 1980 and raised in Wigton, Cumbria. He is studied autofiction as a Northern Bridge Consortium PhD candidate at Northumbria University and has been featured at various book festivals, on BBC radio, and completed a placement at Semiotext(e). His first novel, Malc’s Boy, is the first book to be published by Conduit Press.
About John
John Tottenham is a British-born artist and writer living in Los Angeles. He is the author of four volumes of poetry and writes a column in Artillery, and his paintings and drawings have been exhibited in solo shows in LA and New York. Service is his first novel.
Links to obscure (and not so obscure) things mentioned in this episode
* Order Service by John Tottenham and Malc’s Boy by Shaun Wilson from my local independent bookshop in Sheffield here.
* Find Shaun Wilson on Instagram here.
* Find John Tottenham on Instagram here.
* Find Glenn Fisher on Instagram here.
* Find The Library of Lazy Thinking on Instagram here.
About the Library
The Library of Lazy Thinking is a place to hang out and learn more about books. If you’d like to support the library and get access to everything here, you can become a paid member (and get an exclusive The Library of Lazy Thinking bookmark, sticker, and pin badge). All support goes back into the library, helping to organize live events, exclusive merchandise, and more podcasts.
About Glenn
Glenn Fisher is a writer—wait, Glenn Fisher is me. I’m the one writing this. Let’s drop the third-person act. My writing has been published in Lunate, The Paris Bitter Hearts Pit, 3am Magazine, Dogmatika, and Litro Magazine. I write about books and interview other writers and artists here in The Library of Lazy Thinking. I live in Sheffield and work as a freelance copywriter. I have had a best-selling non-fiction book published on the subject called The Art of the Click. It was published by Harriman House and shortlisted for Business Book of the Year. It has been translated into Simplified Chinese and Korean. I also have a dog called Pablo. He is harder to translate. Indeed, most of my life revolves around trying to understand his often unreasonable demands. Meanwhile, I am currently working on my first novel, The Invention of Memory, and on the eternal, soul-destroying task of finding an agent.



Get full access to The Library of Lazy Thinking at lazythinking.substack.com/subscribe