In the Pit with Cody Schneider | Marketing | Growth | Startups

Your biggest advantage in marketing right now isn’t better ads. It’s understanding what actually makes people buy — and it’s probably not what your feed is telling you.
Rage bait is everywhere. It gets views. It gets engagement. But it doesn’t build trust — and it definitely doesn’t drive real revenue in B2B.
In this episode, we sit down with Jason Levin, co-founder of Memelord.com, to break down why meme marketing is quietly outperforming rage bait, how humor builds trust with high-value buyers, and the exact systems top marketers are using to scale meme-driven acquisition.
The deeper insight: the best marketers aren’t chasing attention — they’re engineering relatability at scale.
You’ll learn how to operationalize memes across multiple accounts, why “remixing” is the real creative advantage, and how to turn humor into a repeatable growth engine.
If you’re thinking about distribution in 2026, this is a playbook most companies still aren’t using.

Guest
Jason Levin — co-founder of Memelord.com, an AI-powered meme marketing platform helping companies scale humor, distribution, and content velocity through AI-generated memes and multi-account social strategies.
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/iamjasonlevin
X: https://x.com/iamjasonlevin

What You’ll Learn
Why rage bait drives views… but fails to convert high-value customers
The difference between attention farming and buyer-driven attention
How meme marketing builds trust faster than traditional content
Why humor is a lever — not a strategy replacement
How to run multiple niche meme accounts for different ICPs
Why remixing content beats originality in modern distribution
How AI is enabling meme velocity at scale
Why relationships still outperform automation in closing deals

Timestamps
00:00 - Introduction to Meme Marketing
00:21 - Guest Introduction: Jason Levin from Memelord.com
00:41 - Memes vs Rage Bait Marketing
01:13 - Tactical Meme Marketing Strategies
02:24 - The Importance of Branding and Trust
03:27 - Rage Bait vs Smart Bait Philosophy
05:01 - Why Meme Marketing Drives Revenue
06:43 - Building Trust in B2B Through Humor
08:13 - Niche Meme Accounts and High-LTV Distribution
10:19 - The Problem with Rage Bait Culture in Silicon Valley
15:00 - Inside Memelord.com: Product, Demo & AI Tools
30:43 - Scaling Distribution, Verified Orgs & Measurement

Key Topics & Insights
1. Rage Bait Gets Attention — But Not Revenue
There’s a growing belief that anger = growth.
But here’s the reality:
Rage bait attracts the wrong audience.
It pulls in:
Low-intent users
People looking to argue
Low purchasing-power audiences
The problem: High-value buyers don’t respond to manipulation — they recognize it.
And when trust is broken, conversion dies.
The takeaway: Views are not revenue.

2. Meme Marketing = Relatability at Scale
Memes work because they create instant recognition.
Instead of forcing attention, they generate:
Emotional alignment
Shared pain points
Fast trust-building through humor
When people feel understood, they convert faster.

3. Humor Is a Lever, Not a Strategy
Memes don’t replace strategy — they amplify it.
Smart marketing stacks multiple levers:
Educational content
Long-form trust building
Paid acquisition
Humor as distribution acceleration

4. Remixing Is the Real Growth Engine
Modern content velocity comes from remixing, not originality.
Instead of creating from scratch:
Take what’s already trending
Apply your ICP’s pain point
Add context and distribution
This is how meme engines scale.

5. Multi-Account Distribution Strategy
Scaling meme marketing requires fragmentation:
Multiple niche accounts
Each targeting a specific persona
Each speaking in a tailored voice
This creates parallel distribution channels instead of relying on one brand feed.

6. Verified Org Arbitrage on X
A key growth hack discussed:
$1,000/month for verified org
Ability to spin affiliate meme accounts
Networked distribution across accounts
This creates ubiquity and compounding reach.

7. Relationships Still Close Revenue
Even in a world of automation:
Conversations
Trust
Long-term relationships
still outperform pure distribution hacks.

8. Measurement Shift: Branded Search
Instead of tracking vanity metrics:
Focus on branded search growth
Use Google Search Console
Measure demand creation, not just clicks
This becomes the true signal of market pull.

9. The Meme Stack Is Becoming a System
Memelord.com represents a shift:
Trend detection
AI generation
Multi-account publishing
Rapid iteration loops
Memes are no longer content — they are infrastructure.

Sponsor
Today’s episode is brought to you by Graphed – an AI data analyst & BI platform.
With Graphed you can:
Connect data like GA4, Facebook Ads, HubSpot, Google Ads, Search Console, Amplitude
Build interactive dashboards just by chatting (no Looker Studio/Tableau learning curve)
Use it as your ETL + data warehouse + BI layer in one place
Ask:
“Build me a stacked bar chart of new users vs. all users over time from GA4”
…and Graphed just builds it for you.
👉 Get a free trial worth $500 plus a personal discovery call to set up your first dashboard: https://graphed.com/

Your “source of truth” for customer acquisition isn’t GA4. It’s what people tell you when they sign up — and right now, that story is changing fast.
In this episode, we unpack a simple but brutally effective tactic: adding a required “How did you hear about us?” field to your signup form — and using that data to understand where real discovery is happening. The surprise? More and more B2B customers are saying social media, even when analytics tools claim otherwise.
But here’s the deeper shift: organic social is hard to measure… unless you track the right trailing indicator. That indicator is branded search.
You’ll learn how to use Google Search Console to track brand-name impressions over time, why it’s becoming the only KPI that matters for modern founder-led marketing, and how branded search creates a defensible moat competitors can’t easily steal.
If you’re planning your marketing strategy for 2026, this is the measurement system you need.
What You’ll Learn
Why signup form attribution is often more reliable than your analytics dashboards
The biggest B2B acquisition shift happening right now: from search → social
Why organic social is nearly impossible to ROI… and how to measure it anyway
The “branded search” metric that acts as a trailing indicator for social discovery
Why branded search is a marketing moat your competitors can’t take from you
How to build a branded-search chart using Google Search Console in minutes
The exact prompt to pull branded impressions by query and track them over time

Timestamps
00:00:00 - Customer Discovery Starts at Signup
00:00:10 - The Shift: Search → Social
00:00:31 - Why Organic Social Now Matters Most
00:00:52 - The Measurement Problem (and the Fix)
00:01:12 - Branded Search = Your Trailing Indicator
00:01:33 - Why Branded Search Is a Moat
00:01:54 - Where to Invest Time, Money, and Energy
00:02:04 - The 2026 Strategy: Grow Brand Searches
00:02:15 - How to Track Branded Search in GSC
00:02:25 - Building the Branded Impressions Chart
00:02:46 - Live Demo: Google Search Console Setup
00:03:07 - Final Thoughts

Key Topics & Insights
1. Signup Attribution Beats Analytics (Almost Every Time)
One of the fastest ways to understand how customers actually found you is simple: add a required “How did you hear about us?” field in your signup form.
Why it works:
It captures customer intent in their words
It reveals channels analytics often misattributes
It shows the real discovery story (not the last-click story)
And the punchline: it often contradicts what GA4 says.
2. The B2B Discovery Shift: Search → Social
If you’ve been paying attention to the data, something big is happening:
People aren’t discovering new software products through search anymore. They’re discovering them on social — then Googling them afterward.
This shift has accelerated over the past 12–18 months. Even in B2B, where trends typically lag behind DTC.
What this means:
SEO is no longer the first touchpoint
Social is becoming the top-of-funnel discovery engine
Search is evolving into a validation channel
3. Organic Social Has a Measurement Problem
The hardest part about investing in organic social is that it’s difficult to tie to ROI.
Whether you’re doing:
Founder-led content
Creator sponsorships
Community distribution
Organic growth loops
…it doesn’t fit neatly into traditional attribution.
So instead of forcing bad ROI models, track the trailing indicator that proves social discovery is working.
4. Branded Search Is the Trailing Indicator That Matters
Here’s the key idea:
When someone discovers your product on social, they don’t click your link. They Google your name.
That branded search becomes the measurable proof:
A discovery event happened
People care enough to look you up
Your brand is entering the market’s memory
This is why branded search growth is one of the strongest indicators of momentum.
If branded search is increasing month-over-month, your brand is winning.
5. Branded Search Creates a Defensible Moat
This is where it becomes more than measurement — it becomes strategy.
Branded search is difficult for competitors to steal. Once people are searching your name, you own that demand.
The only way competitors can interfere:
They bid on your brand in Google Ads
They try to outspend you
Or they attempt to confuse the market
But that’s expensive, obvious, and usually temporary.
So branded search is not only a KPI — it’s defensibility.
6. How to Track Branded Search in Google Search Console
This is the tactical part.
To track branded search over time, you want a chart that shows:
Impressions over time
For queries containing your brand name
Captured in every format your audience might type it
And this is surprisingly easy to pull from Google Search Console.
7. The Exact Chart & Prompt to Build It
The goal is to extract Search Console impressions where queries include your brand name.
Example prompt:
“Build a chart showing total impressions over time for queries containing ‘YOURBRAND’.”Then your job becomes simple:
Increase branded impressions month-over-month through:
social content
distribution
creator partnerships
podcast mentions
repeated brand exposure
consistent visibility
This becomes the clearest signal that marketing is compounding.

Action Steps (Do This Today)
Add a required “How did you hear about us?” field on signup
Review responses weekly (and compare against analytics)
Use Google Search Console to track branded query impressions
Create a monthly KPI: branded impressions growth
Use branded search growth as the scoreboard for your organic social efforts

Sponsor
Today’s episode is brought to you by Graphed – an AI data analyst & BI platform.
With Graphed you can:
Connect data like GA4, Facebook Ads, HubSpot, Google Ads, Search Console, Amplitude
Build interactive dashboards just by chatting (no Looker Studio/Tableau learning curve)
Use it as your ETL + data warehouse + BI layer in one place
Ask:
“Build me a stacked bar chart of new users vs. all users over time from GA4”
…and Graphed just builds it for you.
👉 Get a 14-day free trial with 10 seats for your team: https://graphed.com/

If you’re not getting cited by ChatGPT, your “AI SEO” strategy isn’t working, no matter what your dashboards say. Most of it is observability theater: dashboards, charts, synthetic prompts — and zero actual placement.
In this episode, we chat with Shawn Schneider, founder of Eldil AI, about what actually determines whether your company shows up in ChatGPT answers. The short answer: LLMs don’t reward more content, clever prompts, or prettier dashboards. They reward a small set of trusted third-party sources — and most brands aren’t mentioned in any of them.
Shawn breaks down why observability alone creates a false sense of progress, how to identify the specific citations that dominate your category, and how to turn that insight into real placements through outreach and negotiation. We also unpack why Google Search Console is still the best signal we have for AI-driven queries, how to prioritize the one citation that actually matters, and what the first 30–90 days can look like when you do this correctly.
Guest
Shawn Schneider — founder of Eldil AI, a GEO / AI SEO platform focused on identifying and securing the citations LLMs rely on most; helps brands and agencies win visibility in ChatGPT by targeting the power-law sources that shape AI answers.

Guest Links
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/shawn-schneider-61b2b5207/
Company Website: https://www.eldil.ai/

What You’ll Learn
Why most GEO / AI SEO observability tools are meaningless without actual placements 
The only thing that reliably improves AI search visibility: citation placements
How to use Google Search Console to surface AI fan-out queries
Why synthetic prompt data is still unreliable (and what to trust instead)
The power law of citations: why only 1–3 sources actually matter
How Eldil turns citation discovery into outreach and negotiated placements
What 30–90 days can look like when you secure the right citation
Which industries should invest heavily — and which should ignore this for now
Why ChatGPT dominates referral traffic compared to other LLMs
What happens when ads arrive inside AI search results

Timestamps
00:00 — GEO, AI SEO, AEO: noise vs. reality
00:21 — Why observability tools don’t move the needle
03:55 — Where GEO tools get their data (and why it’s messy)
07:16 — Using Google Search Console as a prompt proxy
09:40 — The three pillars: technical, content, authority
12:07 — Citations as the dominant ranking lever
13:07 — The power law: thousands of citations, one winner
19:07 — How fast results actually show up
20:39 — When building your own citation content makes sense
30:41 — Which business models win with GEO
37:11 — ChatGPT ads and the future of AI search
41:32 — Where to find Shawn and closing thoughts 

Key Topics & Ideas
1. Why dashboards feel good but don’t create outcomes.
Most tools are essentially “Google Analytics for LLMs”
ChatGPT referrals rise naturally as usage increases
Charts go up even if you do nothing
Without placements, observability is just vanity
2. The three common approaches in the market today:
Guessing prompts with LLMs
Clickstream data sourced from Chrome extensions and brokers
Synthetic prompts without transparency
Eldil uses Google Search Console + Analytics as the best available proxy for real intent.
3. How to spot AI-generated fan-out queries:
50+ character queries
High impressions
Low or zero clicks
These often represent LLMs expanding short prompts into long-form searches.
4. The three pillars: Technical, Content, Authority
Technical — can an LLM crawl and understand your site?
Content — does useful information exist?
Authority — does anyone credible back it up?
Authority is the multiplier most teams ignore.
5. What actually shapes AI answers:
Citations are not backlinks, they are semantic explanations
LLMs repeatedly return to the same trusted sources
Third-party listicles and niche blogs dominate citation share
6. The Power Law of Citations
10k–15k citations may exist
200–300 matter
1–3 actually move the needle
If you’re not in those, content volume won’t save you.
7. The real workflow:
Identify high-value customer questions
Extract dominant citations
Rank them by weight
Contact site owners
Negotiate placement
Monitor AI visibility and referral traffic
This is where most tools stop — and where Eldil focuses.
8. How many placements do you need?
Surprisingly few.
You don’t need 100 placements
You need the right one
Then expand into adjacent verticals
This is concentrated betting, not spray-and-pray SEO.
9. Why GEO feels different from traditional SEO:
You are inserting into sources that already rank
Changes can show up in weeks, not years
Meaningful referral growth often appears within ~60–90 days
10. Who Should (and Shouldn’t) Do This
Best fit:
High-ACV B2B SaaS
Long buying cycles
High-LTV e-commerce (supplements, skincare)
ICPs that already live in ChatGPT
If your customers do not use LLMs yet, start elsewhere.
11. Why ChatGPT is the main event
Based on Eldil’s data:
ChatGPT referrals dwarf Perplexity and others
For most companies, this is where focus belongs
Smaller channels still matter for high-ticket sales
12. What’s coming next
Paid placements inside LLMs
Organic plus paid becoming a one-two punch
Citation inventory getting expensive fast
The window for cheap dominance will not last.
Sponsor
Today’s episode is brought to you by Graphed – an AI data analyst & BI platform.
With Graphed you can:
Connect data like GA4, Facebook Ads, HubSpot, Google Ads, Search Console, Amplitude
Build interactive dashboards just by chatting (no Looker Studio/Tableau learning curve)
Use it as your ETL + data warehouse + BI layer in one place
Ask:
“Build me a stacked bar chart of new users vs. all users over time from GA4”
…and Graphed just builds it for you.
👉 Get a free trial worth $500 plus a personal discovery call to set up your first dashboard: https://graphed.com/

Your brand doesn’t exist until it ranks on page one—and most founders have no idea how to make that happen.
In this episode, we break down the exact playbook for getting a brand-new domain to show up in Google for your company name. After going through this process firsthand with Graphed.com, you’ll learn how to choose a rankable name, build the right backlinks, trigger branded search behavior, and use Google Ads to accelerate the whole process.

If you're launching anything new, this is the tactical blueprint you wish you had earlier.
What You’ll Learn
Why ranking for your brand name is the first real trust signal for any startup
How to pick a name and domain you can actually rank for
The “first 100 links” strategy that trains Google to recognize your brand
Simple ways to generate branded search behavior across social and content
How Google quietly tests your domain—and how to know when it’s happening
How to use Google Search Ads to accelerate ranking and protect your brand
Why .com still matters more than any other TLD

Timestamps
00:00 — Why your new domain must rank for your own brand name
00:31 — Why ranking for your brand name is a critical early trust signal
01:03 — The rookie mistake founders make when picking a brand name
01:13 — What ideal, non-competitive SERPs should look like
01:35 — Graphed.com’s journey to finally ranking in position one
01:45 — Overview of the process to teach Google your brand
01:55 — Step 1: Build backlinks to your homepage
03:29 — Step 2: Drive branded search with social posts & content
04:21 — Step 3: Run Google Search Ads on your exact brand name
05:45 — Why you should always buy the .com for your brand
06:16 — Final thoughts + Graphed free trial

Key Topics & Insights
1. Ranking for Your Brand Name = Early-Stage Trust
If someone Googles your company and doesn’t find you, credibility collapses. Ranking for your brand name is one of the first—and easiest—trust signals to secure. Graphed.com took ~2 months to rank, but with this framework, it can happen in as little as 24–48 hours.
2. How to Choose a Rankable Name
Avoid names already used by active companies
Look for search results filled with noise, not competitors
Ideal: two words, few syllables, easy to spell
And always, always buy the .com
3. Build the First 100 Backlinks (Brand-Name Anchors Only)
Your #1 job early is to teach Google what your company is.
Do this by:
Building backlinks to your homepage
Using your brand name as the anchor text (not keywords)
These are foundational “identity” links that help Google map brand → domain.
How to build them:
Submit to software directories
Use link submission services
Cold email companies for guest post swaps
Layer PR on top later
4. Trigger Branded Search Behavior
Once Google sees your backlinks, you need humans to reinforce the signal:
Search your brand name
Click your domain
Spend time on the page
Google then learns:
“When people search this name, this is the site they want.”You create this behavior through:
Social posts
Newsletters
Podcast mentions
Repeated use of the brand everywhere
5. How Google Tests Your Domain
Google will quietly experiment by showing your domain for branded queries.
You’ll see this in Search Console via:
Rising impressions
Increasing CTR
Sudden jumps in average position
This is the moment Google “decides” you belong on page one.
6. Accelerate Everything With Google Search Ads
Run a brand campaign:
Exact-match brand keyword
Minimum bid: around $5
Send traffic to homepage
This forces the association between brand name → your site, and accelerates your rise in organic search.
Brand protection tips:
Raise bids to block competitors
Add sitelinks to take more SERP real estate
Optional: multiple ad accounts (with caution)
7. Why .com Still Beats Every Other Domain
Consumers inherently trust .com more than .io, .co, .xyz, etc.
It drives higher CTR and reduces friction in word-of-mouth.
If the .com isn’t available, pick a new name—don’t settle.

Sponsor
Today’s episode is brought to you by Graphed – an AI data analyst & BI platform.
With Graphed you can:
Connect data like GA4, Facebook Ads, HubSpot, Google Ads, Search Console, Amplitude
Build interactive dashboards just by chatting (no Looker Studio/Tableau learning curve)
Use it as your ETL + data warehouse + BI layer in one place
Ask:
“Build me a stacked bar chart of new users vs. all users over time from GA4”
…and Graphed just builds it for you.
👉 Get a 14-day free trial with 10 seats for your team: https://graphed.com/

There’s a whole narrative right now that “vibe coding is a bubble” and all the MRR from AI-built apps isn’t real.
In this episode, we chat with Jacob Klug, founder of the agency Creme, which specializes in building lovable MVPs on top of tools like Lovable and AI coding assistants. Jacob makes the case that most of the “AI apps are trash” discourse is really a skill issue, not a tool issue—and he breaks down the exact process his team uses to ship full platform-level apps in two-week sprints.
We dig into how to scope and design software that doesn’t look AI-generated, how to think about personal operating systems vs. SaaS, why ideas are getting worse even as tools get better, and how creators and agencies can turn niche domain expertise into real products.
If you’re an operator, marketer, or founder trying to figure out how to actually use AI coding tools (instead of just tweeting about them), this one’s for you.
Guest
Jacob Klug — founder of Creme, an agency building “lovable MVPs” and full-stack products with Lovable + AI tools; helps founders, startups & enterprises ship production apps in weeks without sacrificing UX.

Guest Links
Website: https://www.creme.digital/
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jacob-klug-37b254156/
X (Twitter): https://x.com/Jacobsklug

What You’ll Learn
Why the “vibe coding is a bubble” take is mostly a skill and discipline problem
How Jacob’s agency ships full startup-grade products using Lovable and AI
The PRD-first formula they use before ever opening a builder
How to decide when to build vs. when to buy software in 2025
Why we’re entering a wave of personal OSes and custom internal tools
How to avoid shipping janky AI UI and make your app look intentionally designed
The mindset shift from “I could build anything” → “I will build this one specific thing”
Why specializing in one AI tool (Lovable, Cursor, n8n, etc.) beats being “the AI guy”
Tactical content and lead-gen plays for agencies on LinkedIn and YouTube
How to learn AI tooling without getting paralyzed by the infinite possibilities

Timestamps
00:00 — Vibe coding: bubble or breakthrough?
02:23 — Effective use of no-code tools
05:23 — Stack and scoping for MVP development
07:08 — Trends in personal software development
10:33 — Personal projects: blood work analysis tool
13:00 — Steps to start building custom software
17:49 — Successful and unsuccessful product categories
21:01 — Learning and adopting AI tools
27:45 — Creator collaboration in software development
32:14 — Lead generation strategies for AI-powered agencies

Key Topics & Ideas
1. Bubble or Skill Issue?
Why early no-code/AI apps looked janky
How tools like Lovable increased automation from ~50% → ~85%
The remaining 10–15% where real engineering still matters
Many failures come from non-devs skipping fundamentals
2. How Creme Builds Lovable MVPs
Every project starts with a clear PRD (often drafted with ChatGPT)
AI is used to tighten scope before building
When Creme stays fully in Lovable vs. moving code to Cursor
Using Lovable Cloud for hosting, database, and analytics
3. Personal Operating Systems & Internal Tools
People replacing SaaS subscriptions with their own custom tools
In a 20-person cohort, nearly everyone built workflow apps
Rise of the Personal OS: one system for life + work
Example builds:Bloodwork tracker from PDF uploads
Unified messaging CRM (WhatsApp, Telegram, SMS, email)
Automated 30-second sales briefings

4. How to Learn AI Coding Tools
Half the cohort hadn’t built anything before starting
Main blocker: overwhelm, not skill
Learn core concepts: frontend vs. backend, auth, roles, security
Build daily reps, focus on the next thing you need—not “all of AI”
5. Designing Apps That Don’t Look AI-Generated
Good design is still the hardest and biggest edge
Creme process: build a /components library, define buttons/cards/inputs, assign stable IDs
Tools: Mobbin, Figma Community kits, 21st.dev
Best prompt: “Here’s a screenshot → copy this.”
6. What Works in Product Ideas
Most of Creme’s builds are full startup platforms, not micro-tools
AI makes shipping easier, but ideas are getting worse without depth
Real advantage = domain expertise + niche problem + AI speed
7. Creators x Software
Creators can now ship products without capital
Jacob prefers retainers over equity
Analogy: Like creator brands—most fail, a few go huge
8. Career Strategy: Specialize
Future = verticalized expertise, not “AI generalists”
Specialist lanes: Lovable, Cursor, n8n, automation
Be the person for one tool + one market
9. Content & Lead Gen
Jacob's two rules for content: people are selfish and people are bored
Build content that teaches, sparks emotion, and creates curiosity
Post ~5x/week, prioritize visual posts
Long-term: YouTube deep dives for high-intent inbound

Sponsor
Today’s episode is brought to you by Graphed – an AI data analyst & BI platform.
With Graphed you can:
Connect data like GA4, Facebook Ads, HubSpot, Google Ads, Search Console, Amplitude
Build interactive dashboards just by chatting (no Looker Studio/Tableau learning curve)
Use it as your ETL + data warehouse + BI layer in one place
Ask:
“Build me a stacked bar chart of new users vs. all users over time from GA4”
…and Graphed just builds it for you.
👉 Get a 14-day free trial with 10 seats for your team: https://graphed.com/