The Secure Start® Podcast

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If you think you can do therapeutic residential care and leave it all at the door, Marie Clutton has a gentle challenge for you. Young people notice what we carry, even when we do our best to hide it, and they can spot the difference between performance and authenticity in seconds. That single truth reshapes how we think about professional distance, boundaries, and what it means to be a safe adult around boys and young men who have experienced trauma and displayed harmful sexual behaviour. 

Marie brings over 20 years of experience in therapeutic childcare and therapeutic community practice at Amberleigh Care, an accredited service supporting young males aged 11 to 18. We talk about how a therapeutic community differs from general residential care, including the role of group work, community meetings, and the idea that relationships are the treatment, not something that sits alongside it. You’ll hear why connection and belonging can be protective factors, and how peer support plus peer challenge can open doors that adult-led interventions often cannot. 

We also get practical about safeguarding and risk management: individual risk assessments, structured routines, strong communication, and regular reviews. Along the way, we name the emotional reality for staff too and the importance of containment spaces like reflective group supervision and staff dynamics, so the work does not spill destructively into home life. 

If you care about trauma-informed care, child protection, youth justice, harmful sexual behaviour interventions, or safer residential care practice, this conversation offers both heart and rigour. Subscribe to Secure Start, share this episode with a colleague, and leave a review to help more people find it. What part of relational safety do you think the sector still underestimates?
Marie's Bio:
Marie brings over 25 years of experience in therapeutic childcare and residential care management. She has been part of Amberleigh Care for two decades and possesses extensive expertise in leading within a therapeutic community (TC). She is a qualified groupwork practitioner, holds a Diploma from the IGA, qualified in care leadership and management, is a designated safeguarding lead, is trained DDP Level 2 and  AIM3 Assessment and Intervention, and holds a diploma in Child Care.
Amberleigh Care operates two accredited therapeutic communities for young people, and Marie oversees all therapeutic community processes across the organisation. Her responsibilities include facilitating group dynamics, and collaborating with care, therapy, and education teams. She also works directly with young people in group settings to ensure they feel heard, valued, and engaged within the community.
Marie continues to support young people after they leave Amberleigh Care through peer mentor roles, enabling them to remain connected, share experiences, and contribute to the development of the communities. She is also involved in external events, providing young people with opportunities to share their stories through presentations and workshops.
Marie has served as co-chair of the TCTC Children’s Network for over five years and contributes to research initiatives that support wider professional networks.
Links:
Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/c/TheSecureStartPodcast.                
Podcast Blog Site: https://thesecurestartpodcast.com/
Disclaimer:

Disclaimer: Information reported by guests of this podcast is assumed to be accurate as stated. Podcast owner Colby Pearce is not responsible for any error of facts presented by podcast guests. In addition, unless otherwise specified, opinions expressed by guests of this podcast may not reflect those of the podcast owner, Colby Pearce. Finally, all references to case examples are anonymised to the extent that the actual case could not be identified, or are fictional but based on real-life examples for illustrative purposes, or have client consent to talk about in an educative context.
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A child disappears into the underside of a foam settee, furious when the adults cannot find her. Another child “loses” Super Ted again and again, and what looks like chaos turns into a quiet test: will you come looking, will you bring me back, will I still belong?

I sit down for the second instalment of my recent conversation with Richard Rollinson, much-loved elder of the Mulberry Bush therapeutic community, to unpack what belonging really means in out-of-home care and therapeutic residential care. We talk about how the stories we tell children about their parents can either stabilise them or split them apart, and why it matters to honour birth family without denying harm. Richard shares a practical reframe for the child who says “my mother doesn’t love me”, and we tease out the difference between making a necessary judgement and being judgemental.

From Kryptonite and the fear of being human to Santa versus Satan and the trap of perfection, we explore how young people get stuck in all-or-nothing thinking, and how adults can offer a “common garden” alternative: ordinary, mixed, and survivable. We also tackle a bigger question in residential care policy: the drift towards one-or-two child homes and what we risk losing when we move away from therapeutic communities and the power of the group.

If you care about trauma-informed practice, belonging, life story meaning, and better care for children and young people, press play. Subscribe, share with a colleague, and leave a review so more people can find the conversation.
Richard’s Bio
Richard has a long association with Residential Therapeutic Communities, having worked at the Mulberry Bush School for well over 20 years and where, from 1991 to 2001, he was its Director. He was also Director, Children and Young People, at the Peper Harow Foundation, from 2001 to 2005. 
Richard qualified as a Social Worker with an MSc from Oxford University in 1983, following the then Part 1 training in Child Psychotherapy at the Tavistock Centre. In 2005 he completed the Ashridge MA and training in Organisational Consulting. He has been Chairman of the Charterhouse Group of Therapeutic Communities and for many years the Chairman of the Care Leavers’ Foundation. In 2014 he became Chair of Trustees at the Mulberry Bush School, only recently stepping down from that position, while remaining a Trustee with a special brief for the links and development of the contacts with and participation of former pupils. He has published numerous articles and continues to lecture widely across the UK and Europe.
Links:
Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/c/TheSecureStartPodcast.                
Podcast Blog Site: https://thesecurestartpodcast.com/
Disclaimer:

Disclaimer: Information reported by guests of this podcast is assumed to be accurate as stated. Podcast owner Colby Pearce is not responsible for any error of facts presented by podcast guests. In addition, unless otherwise specified, opinions expressed by guests of this podcast may not reflect those of the podcast owner, Colby Pearce. Finally, all references to case examples are anonymised to the extent that the actual case could not be identified, or are fictional but based on real-life examples for illustrative purposes, or have client consent to talk about in an educative context.

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Care gets framed as gentle and cosy, but that story falls apart the moment you work closely with children who have lived through fear, loss and disruption. I sit down with Richard Rollinson for another instalment of objects that help use remember and think, to explore a tougher, more honest view: care as something we carry, not just something we do. Richard brings two objects to make the point - a Care Bear and the Oxford English Dictionary -  and cites definitions that connect “care” to grief, mental suffering, doubt and sorrow. It lands because it sounds like the real emotional labour of child and youth care, residential care, foster care and therapeutic support.

We remind the listener about Richard’s love of objects and storytelling: how a childhood habit of arranging things, an unforgettable stage performance filled with objects, and decades of practice in the Mulberry Bush community shaped a way of communicating that invites people in rather than telling them off. We talk about presence, remembering and the strange truth that a single detail can hold a whole world, including a photo where a father’s shoe becomes a doorway into family history, disability and connection.

We also get practical about safeguarding and organisational culture. Richard contrasts whistleblowing with something that should sit beside it: voicing concern early, as course correction, so teams can question routines before harm happens. That leads into containment and reflection about how supported staff can hold children’s feelings without becoming punitive, how naming an experience can calm a storm, and how good containment spreads through a group in the best possible way.

If you care for children, lead a team, or want trauma-informed practice that stays human under pressure, you’ll find plenty to pause on. Subscribe, share this with a colleague, and leave a review with your biggest takeaway or the object that carries your story.
Richard’s Bio
Richard has a long association with Residential Therapeutic Communities, having worked at the Mulberry Bush School for well over 20 years and where, from 1991 to 2001, he was its Director. He was also Director, Children and Young People, at the Peper Harow Foundation, from 2001 to 2005. 
Richard qualified as a Social Worker with an MSc from Oxford University in 1983, following the then Part 1 training in Child Psychotherapy at the Tavistock Centre. In 2005 he completed the Ashridge MA and training in Organisational Consulting. He has been Chairman of the Charterhouse Group of Therapeutic Communities and for many years the Chairman of the Care Leavers’ Foundation. In 2014 he became Chair of Trustees at the Mulberry Bush School, only recently stepping down from that position, while remaining a Trustee with a special brief for the links and development of the contacts with and participation of former pupils. He has published numerous articles and continues to lecture widely across the UK and Europe.
Links:
Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/c/TheSecureStartPodcast.                Podcast Blog Site: https://thesecurestartpodcast.com/
Disclaimer:

Disclaimer: Information reported by guests of this podcast is assumed to be accurate as stated. Podcast owner Colby Pearce is not responsible for any error of facts presented by podcast guests. In addition, unless otherwise specified, opinions expressed by guests of this podcast may not reflect those of the podcast owner, Colby Pearce. Finally, all references to case examples are anonymised to the extent that the actual case could not be identified, or are fictional but based on real-life examples for illustrative purposes, or have client consent to talk about in an educative context.
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Send us Fan Mail
“All you need is a big heart and a spare room” might be the most damaging sentence in foster care. I'm joined by Gareth K. Thomas, former foster parent and childhood trauma consultant (Clarified), to unpack why that kind of messaging sets carers up to fail and pulls children into yet another painful move. If we want placement stability and better outcomes for children in out-of-home care, we have to stop treating foster parents like the hired help and start treating them as the primary healing environment.

We talk about what trauma-informed fostering looks like on the ground: co-regulation, widening the window of tolerance, and the small “magic micro moments” that add up to a therapeutic bath no weekly appointment can match. Gareth shares why the best services don’t do therapy to children in isolation, they bring carers into the work and build a shared understanding across schools, social workers, and clinicians. We also dig into the uncomfortable bit, how “support” can become shaming training when a carer says they’re struggling, and why reflective space matters when everyone’s prefrontal cortex is going offline under stress.

You’ll also hear practical examples of the scaffolding that keeps families going: consistent short breaks, empathic listener phone calls, therapeutic supervising social workers, and peer groups where lived experience is treated as real expertise. Gareth closes by sharing what he wants from policy leaders, plus what he’s building next, including Trauma Space and a new book on therapeutic parenting for teens and tweens.

If this conversation helps, subscribe, share it with someone in the care sector, and leave a review so more carers and professionals can find it. What would you change first to make fostering sustainable?
Gareth's Bio:
Gareth K Thomas is a former foster parent and child trauma specialist. He’s a trainer, speaker and (soon-to-be-published author). He works as a trauma-informed consultant through his organisation, Clarified, and is in the process of launching Trauma Space, which will be a course collection and community for those parenting and working with children who’ve experienced trauma.
Links:
Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/c/TheSecureStartPodcast
Podcast Blog Site: https://thesecurestartpodcast.com/
Disclaimer: Information reported by guests of this podcast is assumed to be accurate as stated. Podcast owner Colby Pearce is not responsible for any error of facts presented by podcast guests. In addition, unless otherwise specified, opinions expressed by guests of this podcast may not reflect those of the podcast owner, Colby Pearce. Finally, all references to case examples are anonymised to the extent that the actual case could not be identified, or are fictional but based on real-life examples for illustrative purposes.
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Send us Fan Mail
“Residential care is the last resort” sounds like a policy line, but it lands as a verdict on children and on the people who care for them. In this podcast conversation, Co-Director of the Residential Child Care Project at Cornell University, Martha Holden, and I push back on that idea and explore what happens when group care is treated as a serious, skilled, trauma-informed option rather than a dumping ground for system failures. 

We dig into what TCI is actually for: preventing harm during crisis, reducing power struggles, and helping staff respond to aggressive behaviour without re-traumatising kids. Then we zoom out to the bigger question, what guides the other 23 hours of the day? Martha explains why CARE was built as a foundational program model, how shared principles create congruence across shifts, and why consistency is not a “nice to have” when young people are highly sensitive to change and unpredictability. 

We also get practical about quality and accountability. Measuring residential care against foster care often ignores the reality that many young people arrive after multiple placement breakdowns, so we argue for outcomes that track change from each child’s starting point using effect sizes. 
If you care about residential child care, out-of-home care, workforce wellbeing, and what evidence-informed practice looks like on the ground, this conversation will sharpen your thinking. Subscribe, share it with a colleague, and leave a review. What would you stop doing tomorrow to lift the quality of care?
Martha's Bio:
Martha is a Senior Extension Associate with the Bronfenbrenner Center for Translational Research, and Co-Director of the Residential Child Care Project at Cornell University. Ms Holden is the author of the book, CARE: Creating Conditions for Change a program model for child caring agencies. She is the lead developer of the Therapeutic Crisis Intervention System (TCI) in use in children’s residential organizations since 1980, redeveloped for foster and adoptive parents in 1996, and redeveloped for schools in 2012. She provides technical assistance and training to residential child caring agencies, schools, juvenile justice programs, and child welfare organizations throughout the United States, Canada, the United Kingdom, Ireland, Australia, Spain, and Israel. In addition to her extensive experience in training, writing, and curriculum development, Ms Holden has served as an administrator overseeing the day-to-day operation of a residential treatment agency for children, including its education resources. 
During her career, Martha has been studying how to prevent the occurrence of institutional abuse and improve the quality of care for children in out of home placements through program development, training, technical assistance, and influencing organizational culture.
Links:
Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/c/TheSecureStartPodcast
Podcast Blog Site: https://thesecurestartpodcast.com/
Disclaimer: Information reported by guests of this podcast is assumed to be accurate as stated. Podcast owner Colby Pearce is not responsible for any error of facts presented by podcast guests. In addition, unless otherwise specified, opinions expressed by guests of this podcast may not reflect those of the podcast owner, Colby Pearce. Finally, all references to case examples are anonymised to the extent that the actual case could not be identified, or are fictional but based on real-life examples for illustrative purposes.
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