The Secure Start® Podcast

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“Problem behaviour” is a label that can make adults defensive, punitive and quick to control. We wanted to slow that down and ask a different question: what if the behaviour is pain, showing itself the only way it knows how? For the 50th Secure Start Podcast conversation, I am joined by Professor James Anglin, one of the world’s most influential voices in children’s residential care and therapeutic group home practice. 

We talk through Professor Anglin’s journey from philosophy and Gestalt training into frontline child and youth care, then into the research that shaped his landmark framework. He explains grounded theory in plain language and why building theory from practice gives workers something they can actually use at 2 am when a young person is dysregulated. At the centre is a struggle for congruence: aligning decisions across funders, leadership, supervision and frontline care so the whole system acts in children’s best interests, not just the words on a policy page. 

We dig into three major processes: creating an extra-familial living environment, responding to pain-based behaviour, and helping young people develop a sense of normality and dignity. Along the way we unpack the interactional dynamics that make change possible, the real harm of repeated placement breakdown, and how the Cornell CARE model has scaled these ideas across countries and cultures. 

If you work in child protection, residential care, foster care systems, trauma-informed practice or therapeutic care, this is a concrete guide to doing the work with clarity and humanity. Subscribe to The Secure Start Podcast, share this with someone shaping policy or practice, and leave a review. 
Professor Anglin's Bio:
Professor Anglin began his career as a child and youth care worker in a mental health centre in Vancouver, after which he developed a 6-bed group home for adolescents in Victoria Canada.
He then pursued graduate studies, worked in social policy in Ottawa and Toronto, and returned to British Columbia in 1979 to join the faculty of the School of Child and Youth Care at the University of Victoria.
He served as the School of Child and Youth Care Director for three terms, after which he became the University’s Associate Vice-President Academic and Director of International Affairs.
From 1995 to 1999 he was an international advisor to the South African Inter-Ministerial Committee on Young People at Risk involved in the country’s Transformation of the Child and Youth Care System.
Currently, he is President of FICE-Canada, Chair of FICE Americas, Asia and Australia Region, and a member of the FICE-International Coordinating Committee. He also serves as a member of the International Work Group on Therapeutic Residential Care,
His major research interests have included parent education and support, quality assurance, professionalization of child and youth care, and what constitutes quality residential care for children and youth. James is a Research Affiliate with the Bronfenbrenner Centre for Translational Research at Cornell University advising on the development and implementation of the Cornell CARE Program Model that is now being delivered in 7 countries..
He has published widely in international journals and texts, and serves on the Editorial Boards of the Scottish Journal of Residential Child Care, the Residential Treatment for Children and Youth journal, and the International Journal of Child, Youth and Family Studies.
Links:
Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/c/TheSecureStartPodcast
Podcast Blog Site: https://thesecurestartpodcast.com/
Disclaimer: Information reported by guests of this podcast is assumed to be accurate as stated. Podcast owner Colby Pearce is not responsible for any error of facts presented by podcast guests. In addition, unless otherwise specified, opinions expressed by guests of this podcast may not reflect those of the podcast owner, Colby Pearce. Finally, all references to case examples are anonymised to the extent that the actual case could not be identified, or are fictional but based on real-life examples for illustrative purposes.
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Some children live through severe developmental trauma in plain sight, then grow up to find they are missing from the research, the services, and the stories we tell about “who trauma happens to”. I sit down with Ruth Clare, author, TEDx speaker, and intergenerational trauma educator, to talk about what it means to grow up as the child of a traumatised Vietnam veteran in a home shaped by family violence and addiction, and why children of veterans are still treated like a footnote rather than a category that deserves targeted support. 

We unpack how many child safety and mental health systems quietly depend on a functional adult to report harm, advocate, and follow through, and what happens when every adult freezes or looks away. Ruth shares why compassion is easier when trauma looks like sadness, and why it becomes much harder when trauma shows up as anger, defiance, or volatility. From there, we turn to the places where support can actually be embedded, especially schools, and why an integrated model matters when children spend most of their time either at home or in the classroom. 

Ruth also brings practical nervous system science into the conversation, including the Dan Siegel hand brain model and the moment the thinking brain goes offline. We talk through accessible regulation tools, how neurodivergence can overlap with trauma-like reactivity, and why “strictness” can escalate threat responses rather than create learning. We finish on funding and reform: how to trial new programs like Parenting After Trauma and its 4R model, and why supporting teachers and carers is one of the fastest paths to safer kids. 

If this resonates, subscribe and share the episode with someone working with children, and leave a review so more people can find these conversations. What would change in your workplace if asking direct questions about safety was everyone’s job?
Ruth's Bio
Ruth Clare is an author, TEDx speaker and intergenerational trauma educator whose work bridges research, nervous system science and lived experience.
Author of three books, Ruth's award-winning memoir Enemy (Penguin, 2016), tells the story of growing up as the daughter of a traumatised Vietnam veteran in a home marked by family violence and addiction. Her TEDx talk has over 600,000 views. Ruth's work is dedicated to preventing children growing up in families like hers from falling through the gaps.
With a background in biochemistry and communications, Ruth translates complex trauma research into practical tools and psychoeducation for individuals, practitioners and organisations. She is the developer of Parenting After Trauma (PAT), a structured group program for trauma-affected parents in veteran and first responder families, built around her original Four R model: Recognition, Regulation, Repair, and Reframing.
Links:
Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/c/TheSecureStartPodcast
Podcast Blog Site: https://thesecurestartpodcast.com/
Disclaimer: Information reported by guests of this podcast is assumed to be accurate as stated. Podcast owner Colby Pearce is not responsible for any error of facts presented by podcast guests. In addition, unless otherwise specified, opinions expressed by guests of this podcast may not reflect those of the podcast owner, Colby Pearce. Finally, all references to case examples are anonymised to the extent that the actual case could not be identified, or are fictional but based on real-life examples for illustrative purposes.

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When people are overwhelmed, they don’t need a lecture. They need someone who can help them think again. That’s the heart of our conversation with Dr Laura Steckley, a leading researcher in therapeutic residential childcare, as we tackle one of the most misunderstood ideas in trauma-informed practice: containment.

We start by naming the problem. “Containment” often gets misused to mean restriction, restraint, or simply keeping behaviour quiet. Laura and I unpack the psychodynamic meaning instead: making the uncontainable containable, the unbearable bearable, and the unmanageable manageable. We talk about what uncontainment looks like in real life, when language disappears, anxiety spikes, and a child (or adult) feels like they are coming out of their own skin. From there we map the mechanics of good containment: receiving the emotional message, staying steady enough not to be flooded, processing it, then giving it back with empathic acknowledgement so the other person feels seen, heard and felt.

Containment also isn’t just a one-to-one skill. We explore “holistic containment” in residential care and across organisations, including predictable routines, clear policies, reflective supervision, and the meaning-making conversations that help staff and young people understand what happened. We go straight into leadership too, because senior leaders often need the most containment and get the least, and that gap can shape the entire culture of care.

If you work in residential care, foster care, education, child protection, counselling, or any trauma-informed setting, this will give you language, frameworks and practical ideas you can use immediately. Subscribe to Secure Start, share this with a colleague who carries a lot, and leave a review to help more people find the show. What helps you feel contained when the work gets hard?
Laura’s Bio
Laura previously joined me for episode 20 of The Secure Start Podcast. Those who have listened to that podcast episode will remember that Laura joined the University of Strathclyde in 2003 and that she is simultaneously part of the School of Social Work & Social Policy and CELCIS (the Centre of Excellence for Looked After Children in Scotland).  
Before coming to the University, Laura worked in direct practice, management and training in residential treatment for adolescents in the United States and residential child care in Scotland.
Laura’s research interests broadly involve deepening our understanding of key areas of practice in order to improve the experiences and life chances of children and young people in residential child care.  
In this episode we plan to delve more deeply into the topic of containment.
Links:
Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/c/TheSecureStartPodcast
Podcast Blog Site: https://thesecurestartpodcast.com/
Disclaimer: Information reported by guests of this podcast is assumed to be accurate as stated. Podcast owner Colby Pearce is not responsible for any error of facts presented by podcast guests. In addition, unless otherwise specified, opinions expressed by guests of this podcast may not reflect those of the podcast owner, Colby Pearce. Finally, all references to case examples are anonymised to the extent that the actual case could not be identified, or are fictional but based on real-life examples for illustrative purposes.
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We love neat metrics in children’s social care because they fit on dashboards: placement stability, school attainment, cost per child. But when you sit down with people who’ve actually lived the care system, the story gets messier and far more human. Colby Pearce is joined Professor Dr Lisa Holmes, one of the world’s leading researchers in residential childcare, to ask a simple question with huge consequences: what outcomes are truly meaningful for children in out-of-home care?
We talk about why “countable” outcomes can crowd out what children need to heal and grow, including relationships that don’t get cut off when a placement ends, a sense of belonging and identity, real agency in decisions, and protection from loneliness. Lisa brings a systems lens to the problem, drawing on ecological theory to explain why children’s trajectories are rarely linear and why it’s risky to attribute long-term adult outcomes to a single placement without grappling with timing, instability, disability data gaps, and other confounds.
The conversation then turns to residential care. Yes, it’s expensive, but expensive doesn’t automatically mean poor value for money. We challenge the “last resort” rhetoric and argue for a better frame: placement purpose. What is this placement for, for this young person, right now? We also dig into what quality residential care looks like in practice, from trauma-informed training to strong supervision that supports the workforce to do complex, relational work well. 
If you care about child welfare reform, foster care, kinship care, residential care, and outcomes that actually match children’s hopes for an ordinary life, this one’s for you. 
Lisa’s Bio
Lisa joined the School of Education and Social Work at the University of Sussex in January 2022 as Professor of Applied Social Science. Prior to this she was an Associate Professor and Deputy Director of Research in the Department of Education, University of Oxford. 
Over the past twenty-five years Lisa has carried out a range of research and evaluation projects, with a particular focus on the relationship between needs, costs and outcomes of services and support provided to children and families. Along with her colleagues, Professor James Whittaker and Professor Jorge F del Valle, Lisa is co-chair of the International Work Group for Therapeutic Residential Care and is a board member of the European Scientific Association On Residential And Family Care For Children And Adolescents (EuSARF) and the Association of Children’s Residential and Community Services (ACRC). In late 2017, along with colleagues at University College London and the University of Oxford, Lisa established the Children's Social Care Data User Group. The group provides a forum to share expertise and learning between all users and potential users (academic, practice and policy) of children's social care (child welfare) data. 
Lisa has published a range of books and journal articles. Over the past two years she has presented her research in Australia, South Korea, Spain, Finland, Croatia, Lithuania and the US.
Links:
Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/c/TheSecureStartPodcast
Podcast Blog Site: https://thesecurestartpodcast.com/
Disclaimer: Information reported by guests of this podcast is assumed to be accurate as stated. Podcast owner Colby Pearce is not responsible for any error of facts presented by podcast guests. In addition, unless otherwise specified, opinions expressed by guests of this podcast may not reflect those of the podcast owner, Colby Pearce. Finally, all references to case examples are anonymised to the extent that the actual case could not be identified, or are fictional but based on real-life examples for illustrative purposes.

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Supervision can look calm on the outside while a whole attachment system is firing underneath. When a supervisee is worried about risk, second-guessing an intervention, or feeling judged, the supervision room stops being a “case review” and becomes a relationship shaped by safety, power, and emotion. That’s where attachment theory becomes more than an idea, it becomes a practical lens for clinical supervision.

We sit down with Dr Alex Rowell, clinical psychologist, educator, and certified supervisor, to talk about attachment-based supervision and why it fits across orientations, from psychodynamic psychotherapy to structured approaches. We unpack what it means for a supervisor to function as a secure base and safe haven, how anxious and avoidant patterns can show up for both supervisee and supervisor, and why the best supervision often feels emotionally attuned rather than purely administrative. Along the way, we explore parallel process, the supervisory alliance, and how a supervisor’s own attachment style can quietly shape their responses under stress.

We also get real about constraints: heavy caseloads, system pressure, and the fact that many clinicians are “voluntold” to supervise with little formal training. We discuss rupture and repair after hard feedback, the built-in power dynamic of supervision, and when developmental or CBT-style structure is exactly what a supervisee needs. If you supervise, get supervised, or train clinicians, you’ll walk away with clearer language and practical prompts for making supervision safer, sharper, and more humane.

If this conversation helps you, please subscribe, share it with a colleague, and leave a review so more supervisors and trainees can find it. What supervision moment made you feel most supported.
Alex’s Bio
Dr. Alex Rowell is a practicing clinical psychologist in the United Stated and United Kingdom. He has a wide range of clinical and professional experiences that include working in various inpatient/outpatient hospitals, non-profit organizations, multiple college-counseling centers, the National Health Service (NHS), higher education, and currently works virtually in private practice. His areas of interests include clinical supervision/supervising, mood disorders, self-compassion, teaching, mindfulness, burnout, and gender awareness and education. Dr. Rowell has presented on peripartum mental health, multicultural awareness, clinical supervision, Psychodynamic psychotherapy, and personality disorders at various conferences. He practices mainly from an Attachment informed, Psychodynamic, and Humanistic/Existential lens; he is also RAPPS (Register of Applied Psychology Practice Supervisors) certified through the BPS (British Psychological Association). 
Links:
Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/c/TheSecureStartPodcast
Podcast Blog Site: https://thesecurestartpodcast.com/
Alex's Linked In: https://www.linkedin.com/in/dralexrowell/

Disclaimer: Information reported by guests of this podcast is assumed to be accurate as stated. Podcast owner Colby Pearce is not responsible for any error of facts presented by podcast guests. In addition, unless otherwise specified, opinions expressed by guests of this podcast may not reflect those of the podcast owner, Colby Pearce. Finally, all references to case examples are anonymised to the extent that the actual case could not be identified, or are fictional but based on real-life examples for illustrative purposes.

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