Lessons I Learned in Law

Umar Aziz, Partner, Chief Operating Officer and General Counsel at DG Partners, joins Scott Brown to share lessons from a career that nearly took him into shipping brokerage before a major life event brought him back to law.
In this episode of Lessons I Learned in Law, Umar reflects on how personal circumstances shaped the start of his legal career, including his decision to return to Clifford Chance after initially turning down his training contract. His first lesson is that there is more to life than work. Drawing on his own experiences of loss, family responsibility and high-pressure legal environments, he discusses the importance of building a full life outside the job — and why excellence matters across work, family, friendships and personal pursuits.
His second lesson comes from advice he received early in his career: learn from the best bits of the lawyers around you. Umar explains why every lawyer you work with has something worth copying — and something worth leaving behind.
His final lesson challenges the idea that lawyers should always try to “win” every point. Whether negotiating with clients, managing internal teams or building long-term business relationships, Umar argues that sustainable success comes from fairness, trust and mutual respect — not squeezing every last drop out of the other side.
Along the way, Umar discusses moving from litigation into funds, the transition from private practice into DG Partners, his COO and GC role, and why full-contact karate helps him stay disciplined, present and switched off from work. 
This episode is brought to you in partnership with Wordsmith AI — the legal AI platform built specifically for in-house teams.
Guest Recommendations
Sport: Full-contact karate 
Sauce of choice: Buffalo or curry sauce 
Resources & Links Mentioned in This Episode
Register your interest in joining The Lodge In-house Legal Community: https://bit.ly/TheLodgebyHB 
Heriot Brown: https://heriotbrown.com/ 
Wordsmith AI: https://www.wordsmith.ai/ 
Legal Engineering Project Application form: https://wordsmith.fillout.com/legalengproject 
Listen to the Podcast
Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/
 Apple Podcast: https://podcasts.apple.com/4
 YouTube: http://www.youtube.com/
Connect with Heriot Brown
https://heriotbrown.com/ 
About Heriot Brown:
At Heriot Brown, we help lawyers find fulfilment in their careers. Beyond recruitment, we foster a thriving community of in-house legal professionals who share insights, experiences, and growth opportunities.
Enjoyed this episode? Subscribe to Lessons I Learned in Law, leave a review, and share it with someone building their career in legal leadership.
Chapters:
 00:00 Intro – Umar Aziz & DG Partners  
 03:40 Turning down Clifford Chance twice  
 09:28 From private practice to GC & COO  
 16:12 Lesson 1 – There’s more to life than work  
 24:03 Karate, resilience & switching off  
 30:08 Lesson 2 – Learn from great lawyers  
 34:22 Lesson 3 – Winning isn’t everything  
 39:55 Building long-term relationships  
 44:31 GC, COO & wearing multiple hats  
 56:42 Hot or Not, AI & closing thoughts

Selene Brett, Chief Legal, Risk and Compliance Officer at PPRO, joins Scott Brown to share thoughtful lessons on legal leadership, humility, and how lawyers can add real value without hiding behind the mystique of the profession.
In this episode of Lessons I Learned in Law, Selene reflects on her role at PPRO, a payments platform helping merchants and payment service providers connect to local payment methods around the world. With a broad remit spanning legal, risk, compliance, outsourcing and internal audit, she discusses what drew her to a business where those functions are seen as strategic enablers rather than the “business prevention unit”.
Her first lesson is that lawyers are special, but not that special. Selene challenges the idea that legal teams should sit above the business as guardians of all good judgement. Instead, she argues lawyers earn their seat at the table by being approachable, constructive and genuinely useful.
Her second lesson is to make it count. Senior legal roles come with influence, access and privilege — and Selene believes that creates a responsibility to use that position well, whether through difficult conversations, mentoring, or helping others find routes into the profession.
Finally, she talks about gathering the nuggets: taking something meaningful from every role, every relationship and every experience, even the difficult ones. From rural Norfolk to Harvard, New York and senior in-house leadership, Selene’s story is a reminder that careers rarely move in straight lines — and that empathy, trust and agency matter just as much as technical skill. 
This episode is brought to you in partnership with Wordsmith AI — the legal AI platform built specifically for in-house teams.
Guest Recommendations
Sauce of choice for chicken nuggets: Blue cheese 
Event recommendation: Heriot Brown’s Charity Burns Night 
Resources & Links Mentioned in This Episode
Register your interest in joining The Lodge In-house Legal Community: https://bit.ly/TheLodgebyHB 
Heriot Brown: https://heriotbrown.com/ 
Wordsmith AI: https://www.wordsmith.ai/ 
Legal Engineering Project Application form: https://wordsmith.fillout.com/legalengproject 
Listen to the Podcast
Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/
 Apple Podcast: https://podcasts.apple.com/4
 YouTube: http://www.youtube.com/
Connect with Heriot Brown
https://heriotbrown.com/ 
About Heriot Brown:
At Heriot Brown, we help lawyers find fulfilment in their careers. Beyond recruitment, we foster a thriving community of in-house legal professionals who share insights, experiences, and growth opportunities.
Enjoyed this episode? Subscribe to Lessons I Learned in Law, leave a review, and share it with someone building their career in legal leadership.

Jim Shaughnessy, Chief Legal Officer at DocuSign, joins Scott Brown to share lessons from more than 20 years operating at the top of global legal teams.
In this episode of Lessons I Learned in Law, Jim reflects on his role leading legal at DocuSign, a business best known for e-signature and now expanding into intelligent agreement management. He explains how DocuSign is helping businesses move beyond signing documents into managing agreements more intelligently, using AI, automation and better contract visibility.
Jim’s first lesson is that an in-house legal career is not always about the law. For senior lawyers, influence is everything: being in the room when important decisions are made, being sought out when the issue is broader than pure legal advice, and helping the business get important things done.
His second lesson is a reminder that influence only works if it is underpinned by technical excellence. Lawyers may contribute to strategy, policy and commercial decision-making, but when the issue is legal, they need to be precise, trusted and properly prepared.
Finally, Jim discusses the importance of professional identity. At every stage of a legal career, lawyers need to understand what success looks like in their role, which relationships matter most, and how to build credibility for the next step. He also shares his perspective on AI, why legal teams should embrace change, and how junior lawyers can create real impact by experimenting with new tools.
This episode is brought to you in partnership with Wordsmith AI — the legal AI platform built specifically for in-house teams.
Guest Recommendations
Song: Talk of the Town – The Pretenders 
Resources & Links Mentioned in This Episode
Register your interest in joining The Lodge In-house Legal Community: https://bit.ly/TheLodgebyHB 
Heriot Brown: https://heriotbrown.com/ 
Wordsmith AI: https://www.wordsmith.ai/ 
Legal Engineering Project Application form: https://wordsmith.fillout.com/legalengproject 
Listen to the Podcast
 Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/
 Apple Podcast: https://podcasts.apple.com/4
 YouTube: http://www.youtube.com/
Connect with Heriot Brown
https://heriotbrown.com/ 
About Heriot Brown:
At Heriot Brown, we help lawyers find fulfilment in their careers. Beyond recruitment, we foster a thriving community of in-house legal professionals who share insights, experiences, and growth opportunities.
Enjoyed this episode? Subscribe to Lessons I Learned in Law, leave a review, and share it with someone building their career in legal leadership.
Chapters:
00:00 Intro – Jim Shaughnessy & DocuSign 
03:12 Beyond e-signature – DocuSign IAM 
10:52 Lesson 1 – Influence matters most 
18:06 Building influence as a junior lawyer 
24:38 AI leadership & visibility in legal teams 
29:28 Using influence at the right time 
36:58 Lesson 2 – Be an excellent lawyer first 
44:54 One-way vs two-way door decisions 
48:43 Lesson 3 – Professional identity matters 
01:01:44 Hot or Not, AI & closing thoughts

James Ryan, Chief Legal Officer and Chief Business Officer at BioNTech, joins Scott Brown to discuss the lessons he’s learned leading through one of the most transformative periods in the biotech industry.
In this episode of Lessons I Learned in Law, James reflects on his journey from scientist to lawyer, before eventually stepping into one of the most influential legal leadership roles in biotech. Joining BioNTech before it became globally recognised, he shares what it was like helping scale a fast-growing research-focused company into a world-leading biotechnology business, while navigating the intensity and pressure that came with rapid global growth and strategic partnerships, including BioNTech’s landmark collaboration with Pfizer.
James’ first lesson focuses on the importance of curiosity. From scientific research to complex legal negotiations, he explains why asking better questions, understanding the client’s objectives, and genuinely engaging with the business leads to stronger advice and deeper trust.
His second lesson is about objectivity. James discusses the challenge lawyers face when businesses want a particular answer — and why legal leaders must remain calm, analytical, and willing to give the advice that needs to be heard, not simply the advice others want.
Finally, he talks about remembering that everyone is human. Reflecting on periods of extreme pressure and workload, James explains why approachable legal teams build stronger businesses, why mistakes need to be surfaced early rather than hidden, and why lawyers need downtime and perspective to perform at their best.
Along the way, James also shares insights into:
Transitioning from Chief Legal Officer into a broader Chief Business Officer role 
How legal teams earn influence inside high-growth businesses 
Why biotech companies think differently about risk 
The importance of relationships, curiosity, and trust in leadership 
How climbing helps him switch off and solve problems more effectively 
This episode is brought to you in partnership with Wordsmith AI — the legal AI platform built specifically for in-house teams.
Guest Recommendations
Film: Free Solo 
Hobby: Climbing 
Resources & Links Mentioned in This Episode
Register your interest in joining The Lodge In-house Legal Community: https://bit.ly/TheLodgebyHB 
ECA: https://www.cpduk.co.uk/courses/heriot-brown-executive-counsel-accelerator-eca-course
Wordsmith AI: https://www.wordsmith.ai/ 
Listen to the Podcast
Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/
 Apple Podcast: https://podcasts.apple.com/4
 YouTube: http://www.youtube.com/
Connect with Heriot Brown
https://heriotbrown.com/ 
About Heriot Brown:
 At Heriot Brown, we help lawyers find fulfilment in their careers. Beyond recruitment, we foster a thriving community of in-house legal professionals who share insights, experiences, and growth opportunities.
Enjoyed this episode? Subscribe to Lessons I Learned in Law, leave a review, and share it with someone building their career in legal leadership.
Chapters:
00:00 Intro – James Ryan & BioNTech 
03:22 CLO to Chief Business Officer 
05:42 BioNTech before COVID 
07:21 From s

Lucy Tyrrell, General Counsel at Wordsmith AI, joins Scott Brown to explore how in-house lawyers can evolve by combining legal expertise with technology, process design, and commercial thinking.
In this episode of Lessons I Learned in Law, Lucy shares her journey from private practice into high-growth tech environments, culminating in her role at a fast-scaling legal AI startup backed by Index Ventures and General Catalyst. Sitting at the intersection of law and product, she offers a unique perspective on what it means to be an “AI-native” legal function—where lawyers don’t just advise the business, but actively shape how legal work is delivered.
Her first lesson centres on thinking like the business. Lucy explains why legal advice cannot exist in isolation and how understanding commercial drivers—often expressed through metrics—allows lawyers to prioritise effectively and deliver more impactful guidance.
Her second lesson highlights the power of networks, both internally and externally. Whether navigating uncertainty, making career decisions, or solving unfamiliar problems, she emphasises the importance of knowing who to turn to and building relationships before you need them.
Finally, she focuses on curiosity—encouraging lawyers to embrace new technology, experiment with AI tools, and develop “legal engineering” skills. Rather than waiting for perfection, she advocates for a mindset of testing, learning, and iterating—mirroring how modern tech teams operate.
This episode is brought to you in partnership with Wordsmith AI — the legal AI platform built specifically for in-house teams.
Guest Recommendations
Song: The Chain – Fleetwood Mac 
Resources & Links Mentioned in This Episode
Register your interest in joining The Lodge In-house Legal Community: https://bit.ly/TheLodgebyHB 
Legal Engineering Project (Slack Community for in-house lawyers): [APPLICATION FORM LINK] 
Wordsmith AI: https://www.wordsmith.ai/ 
Listen to the Podcast
Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/
 Apple Podcast: https://podcasts.apple.com/4
 YouTube: http://www.youtube.com/
Connect with Heriot Brown
https://heriotbrown.com/ 
About Heriot Brown:
At Heriot Brown, we help lawyers find fulfilment in their careers. Beyond recruitment, we foster a thriving community of in-house legal professionals who share insights, experiences, and growth opportunities.
Enjoyed this episode? Subscribe to Lessons I Learned in Law, leave a review, and share it with someone building their career in legal leadership.
Chapters:
00:00 Opening insight – Metrics, AI & modern legal roles 
00:48 Scott introduces Lucy Tyrrell, GC at Wordsmith AI 
03:39 Inside a legal tech business & AI-native legal teams 
09:23 Lesson 1 – Think like the business 
16:06 From private practice to in-house & startup life 
20:48 Lesson 2 – Your network is everything 
29:50 Career opportunities driven by relationships 
31:31 Lesson 3 – Stay curious & embrace change 
40:53 Hot or Not – KPIs, AI & legal team performance 
47:21 Walk-on song, legal engineering & closing reflections