The Modern Therapist's Survival Guide with Curt Widhalm and Katie Vernoy

Before You Refer to the Hospital: De-Escalation, Safety Planning, and Wraparound Care for Teens in Crisis

When a suicidal teen is in crisis, is the hospital really the safest call? What outpatient therapists need to know.

Curt Widhalm, LMFT, leads this episode from his work running a comprehensive DBT private practice in Los Angeles that specializes in higher-acuity adolescent cases, including teens with serious suicidality, self-harm, and emotional dysregulation. These are exactly the clients most often routed toward psychiatric hospitalization or platform-based care, and Curt argues the default-to-hospital reflex frequently makes things worse, not better.

Drawing on recent research and his clinical experience, Curt walks through the iatrogenic harms of adolescent psychiatric inpatient care, why post-discharge is the highest-risk window for completed suicide, and how clinician anxiety can drive premature 5150 holds and crisis referrals. Katie Vernoy, LMFT, joins with years of LPS-designated assessment experience from community mental health, naming what really happens when a teen gets sent in, including the relational rupture that often starts the moment a crisis evaluation is requested.



Together they show outpatient therapists, including solo practitioners, how to build the clinical infrastructure that makes hospital diversion a real option: standardized risk assessment, collaborative safety planning that starts at intake, verbal de-escalation, family-integrated care, and wraparound treatment teams that include both formal providers and informal natural supports.



This is a continuing education podcourse. Therapists can earn 1 CE credit through the Modern Therapist Learning Community at moderntherapistcommunity.com.



What you'll take away:

- How to recognize when a teen client really needs inpatient care, and when escalation will cause more harm than help

- How to use standardized risk assessment tools (C-SSRS, LRAMP) without losing the therapeutic relationship

- How to build a safety plan that actually works, and what to leave out (hint: no-suicide contracts)

- What to teach parents about verbal de-escalation and environmental modifications at home

- How to construct a mini Intensive Outpatient Program inside a solo or small-group practice

- Who belongs on a wraparound treatment team, and how to find informal supports that families often forget to mention

- How systemic barriers and health disparities shape access and outcomes for Black, Hispanic, and lower-SES adolescents



Timestamps:

00:15 - CE intro and how to earn 1 CE credit

05:17 - Why outpatient therapists need real de-escalation protocols

11:23 - What actually happens during a crisis evaluation, with Katie's LPS-designated insights

18:46 - Iatrogenic harm and post-discharge suicide risk in adolescents

26:27 - Distant admissions, capped beds, and reentry into school and community

30:43 - Building safety plans from the first session, not the first crisis

34:32 - What belongs in a comprehensive adolescent safety plan

41:05 - When a teen says "I want to die," and why language matters

47:27 - Family-integrated care in solo private practice

48:56 - Building a mini IOP without the institutional overhead

55:29 - Wraparound teams and the role of informal natural supports

59:51 - ROIs, HIPAA-compliant communication, and minor consent

1:01:00 - Health disparities and access for marginalized adolescents



Earn 1 CE credit:

Therapists can earn 1 CE credit for this episode through the Modern Therapist Learning Community. Register, purchase the course, pass the post-test, and complete the evaluation to receive your certificate. Therapy Reimagined is approved by the California Association of Marriage and Family Therapists (CAMFT CEPA #132270). Please check with your licensing board to confirm eligibility.



Full show notes, references, and transcript: mtsgpodcast.com

CE enrollment: moderntherapistcommunity.com



Join the Modern Therapist Community:

Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/c/mtsgpodcast

Facebook Group: https://www.facebook.com/groups/therapyreimagined



Modern Therapist's Survival Guide Creative Credits:

Voice Over by DW McCann: https://www.facebook.com/McCannDW/

Music by Crystal Grooms Mangano: https://groomsymusic.com/

Inside the Troubled Teen Industry: Wilderness Therapy, Residential Treatment, and the Harm Done to Kids – An Interview with
Chelsea Maldonado and Dr. Will Dobud

Dr. Will Dobud and survivor advocate Chelsea Maldonado on wilderness therapy, residential treatment, institutional abuse, and what therapists need to know to support troubled teen industry survivors. 

Curt and Katie talk with Dr. Will Dobud and Chelsea Maldonado about what actually happens inside the troubled teen industry, why the marketing rarely matches the reality, and how wilderness therapy programs and residential treatment facilities continue to operate despite decades of survivor testimony, documented abuse, and youth deaths. 

The conversation covers why so many adopted youth and foster youth end up in these facilities, how restraints, isolation, and medical neglect produce lasting trauma, and why power dynamics and institutional structure undermine real therapeutic work. Will and Chelsea also discuss the silence of professional associations after youth deaths, the recent Atlantis Leadership Academy case in Jamaica, and what therapists working with troubled teen industry survivors can do to create safer therapeutic relationships. 

In this episode, we discuss: 

What therapists get wrong about wilderness therapy and residential treatment

Why "round the clock therapy" marketing rarely matches the reality inside facilities

How restraints, isolation, and medical neglect cause lasting harm

Why adopted youth and foster youth are disproportionately placed in these programs

The role of power dynamics and institutional structure in the troubled teen industry

Why survivors are highly traumatized and highly therapy resistant

How therapists can work more safely and effectively with survivors

The silence of professional associations after youth deaths in licensed, accredited facilities 

Timestamps: 

07:34 – What actually happens inside troubled teen industry facilities

13:04 – Katie reflects on her own residential treatment experience

16:28 – Common harms: restraints, medical neglect, sexual abuse

19:38 – Power, conversion-style programming, and adopted youth

24:31 – Why these facilities still exist

28:07 – Attachment, restraints, and institutional contradictions

33:00 – What actually helps youth in crisis

38:14 – The Atlantis Leadership Academy case and survivor-led advocacy 

Guests:

Dr. Will Dobud, Senior Lecturer in Social Work at Charles Sturt University and former wilderness therapy field guide whose research focuses on improving outcomes for teenagers and exposing harm in the troubled teen industry (willdobud.com).

Chelsea Maldonado, troubled teen industry survivor, lead researcher for the Trapped in Treatment podcast, and consultant to Paris Hilton's nonprofit 11:11 Media Impact (1111mediaimpact.com). 

Full show notes and transcript: mtsgpodcast.com 

Join the Modern Therapist Community 

Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/c/mtsgpodcast

Facebook Group: https://www.facebook.com/groups/therapyreimagined 

Modern Therapist's Survival Guide Creative Credits 

Voice Over by DW McCann: https://www.facebook.com/McCannDW/

Music by Crystal Grooms Mangano: https://groomsymusic.com/

Why Therapists Stop Working with Kids and What It Takes to Stay: Sustainability, Boundaries, and Pivots for the Long Haul

Curt Widhalm, LMFT, and Katie Vernoy, LMFT push back on the field's quiet stereotype that working with kids is the "starter home" of private practice, the place clinicians put in time before graduating to a cardigan and a wing-back chair. Working with kids and teens is not entry-level work. It is some of the most clinically and physically demanding work in the profession, and it has a sustainability problem that rarely gets named honestly.

Curt and Katie examine why so many therapists who work with kids and teens hit a wall around the five-year mark, and why that wall is rarely about clinical depth. They unpack the sensory toll, the parent communication load, the school and provider coordination, the cost of running a play therapy room, and the way a child caseload can quietly distort a clinician's sense of what is developmentally typical.

They also talk about how to build a long-haul career working with kids, teens, and families without becoming, in Curt's words, "a cynical, glitter-covered shell of a human being." This is a conversation for therapists in private practice, supervisors of clinicians who work with minors, and anyone weighing whether to keep working with kids, scale back, or pivot.

In this episode, we discuss:

Why working with kids is not a lesser clinical specialty

Why the work is hard to sustain, and why "burnout" alone does not fully explain it

How shifting from kid sessions to family work and parent work extends the clinical impact

The sensory, physical, and administrative load of working with kids

Why parents contact child therapists more than adult clients contact their own therapists

The financial and logistical reality of running a play therapy room

How a clinical caseload can distort a therapist's sense of typical development

When a pivot to adult, family, or parent work is healthy, and when it is avoidance

Timestamps:

00:15 — The "starter home" stereotype, and the five-year wall

06:03 — The 167-hour problem and why kid work is family work

10:08 — The sensory and physical toll

12:58 — Caseload diversification and structuring the day

19:41 — The unpaid hours: parents, schools, and the village

23:43 — The play therapy industrial complex

27:59 — Keeping up with kids' culture without losing yourself

30:19 — How a clinical caseload distorts the sense of typical development

33:09 — Expectations, moral injury, and what "fix my kid" really costs

35:01 — When a pivot is survival, and when it is avoidance

Full show notes and resources: mtsgpodcast.com

Join the Modern Therapist Community
Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/c/mtsgpodcast

Facebook Group: https://www.facebook.com/groups/therapyreimagined

Modern Therapist's Survival Guide Creative Credits
Voice Over by DW McCann — https://www.facebook.com/McCannDW/

Music by Crystal Grooms Mangano — https://groomsymusic.com/

When Good Moms Feel Bad: Supporting Mothers in Therapy with IFS and the Mom Parts Method – An Interview with Jessica Tomich Sorci, LMFT

Jessica Tomich Sorci, LMFT, creator of the Mom Parts Method, on IFS, maternal mental health, mom shame, and why "bad mom" parts are protectors, not problems.

Curt and Katie talk with Jessica Tomich Sorci, LMFT about what therapists often miss when working with mothers, and how Internal Family Systems (IFS) can be adapted for the real conditions of motherhood. Jessica is the creator of the Mom Parts Method and author of When Good Moms Feel Bad: An Empowering Guide for Transforming Guilt, Anxiety and Anger into Compassion, Confidence and Connectedness (Balance, 2026).

Drawing on more than fifteen years of clinical work in maternal mental health, Jessica translates IFS into accessible, motherhood-native language. The Mom Parts Method gives mothers simple tools to identify their parts, access their Inner Mom, and approach guilt, grief, rage, and overwhelm with curiosity instead of correction.

This is a useful conversation for therapists working with mothers, perinatal mental health clinicians, and anyone interested in more affirming, non-pathologizing approaches to maternal mental health.

In this episode, we discuss:

What therapists often get wrong when working with mothers

How the Mom Parts Method translates IFS into motherhood-native language

The role of patriarchy, under-resourcing, and matrescence in maternal distress

Why "bad mom" parts (rage, panic, perfectionism, the inner critic) are protectors

The five-step Mom Parts Method, from triggering event to remedy

How therapists' own parts show up in this work

Why healing in maternal mental health is wholeness, not elimination

Full show notes and transcript: mtsgpodcast.com

Timestamps:

03:30 - What therapists get wrong with mothers

04:47 - Shame and the "bad mom" taboo

10:45 - Patriarchy, matrescence, and the systemic context

17:42 - The five-step Mom Parts Method

29:56 - Healing is wholeness, not elimination

33:48 - When to bring parts work into session

35:27 - When Good Moms Feel Bad and Mothercentered training

Guest Bio:

Jessica Tomich Sorci, LMFT is a Level 3 Certified IFS Therapist, IFSI Approved Clinical Consultant, and a Certified Perinatal Mental Health therapist (PMH-C) with advanced training in IFIO. She is the creator of the Mom Parts Method and author of When Good Moms Feel Bad (Balance, 2026). She trains clinicians through her Mothercentered certification program. Learn more at www.momparts.com.

Join the Modern Therapist Community

Podcast: mtsgpodcast.com
Patreon: patreon.com/c/mtsgpodcast
Facebook Group: https://www.facebook.com/groups/therapyreimagined

Modern Therapist's Survival Guide Creative Credits
Voice Over by DW McCann: https://www.facebook.com/McCannDW/
Music by Crystal Grooms Mangano: https://groomsymusic.com/

Why Fixing Teens Doesn’t Work and What Actually Helps Youth Mental Health: An Interview with Dr. Will Dobud

Curt and Katie talk with Dr. Will Dobud about what therapists often get wrong when working with teens, why adolescent behavior is so often overpathologized, and how connection, play, risk, and mastery can better support youth mental health. They also explore the so-called youth mental health crisis, the impact of overmanagement and disconnection, and what therapists can do to better engage young people in meaningful, developmentally appropriate ways.

About Our GuestDr. Will Dobud is a social worker, researcher, and educator who has worked with adolescents and families in the United States, Australia, and Norway. He is a Senior Lecturer in Social Work at Charles Sturt University and an award-winning researcher focused on improving therapy outcomes for teenagers and promoting safe, ethical practices. His work has also examined America’s Troubled Teen Industry, especially wilderness therapy.

Key Takeaways

Teens are often overpathologized when they may be showing developmentally normal behavior.

Youth therapy should focus on engagement, interaction, play, and doing things together, not just sitting and talking.

Social disconnection, fewer third spaces, and less unstructured play may be contributing to youth distress.

Young people will seek connection wherever they can find it, including online and through AI relationships.

Therapists can help teens build resilience by supporting autonomy, mastery, and meaningful participation.

Find the full show notes and transcript at mtsgpodcast.com.

Join the Modern Therapist Community:
Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/c/mtsgpodcast
Podcast Homepage: https://mtsgpodcast.com
Facebook Group: https://www.facebook.com/groups/therapyreimagined
Linktree: https://linktr.ee/therapyreimagined

Modern Therapist’s Survival Guide Creative Credits:
Voice Over by DW McCann: https://www.facebook.com/McCannDW/
Music by Crystal Grooms Mangano: https://groomsymusic.com/