Third Space Podcast

• 15: Catholicism and Christian Universalism

  Today, I wanted to share a conversation I had a few weeks ago with Sean Mitchell over on his Youtube channel, Apostolate of the Ear. Sean reached out to me a few months ago to see if I’d be interested in discussing Christian Universalism and explore my belief that a person can be within the bounds of Catholic orthodoxy and have a sure and certain hope that God will save everyone. And I was very happy to agree. Sean was a gracious interviewer and I had a great time talking with him.LINKSApostolate of the Earhttps://www.youtube.com/@apostolateoftheear3719Details for my Spring 2025 spiritual abuse workshophttps://www.catholicthirdspace.com/p/spiritual-abuse-workshop-627ABOUT THIRD SPACE: Third Space is the podcast for those who see the beauty of Catholicism, as well as the ugliness, who have experienced real harm AND real grace in the Church. Every episode I will have conversations with guests about the good and the bad in the Church—avoiding easy answers or black & white fundamentalism—in order to hold on to all that is true.SUPPORT THIS SHOW: Please consider becoming a paid subscriber. All of your support directly helps my family and allows me to continue working on projects like this podcast, the newsletter, as well as resources about spiritual abuse in the Catholic Church.www.catholicthirdspace.comABOUT THE HOST: Paul Fahey lives in Michigan with his wife and five kids. He is a limited licensed professional counselor, retreat leader, and catechist. He is a co-founder of Where Peter Is, founder and co-host of the Pope Francis Generation podcast, and the host of the Third Space podcast. He seeks to provide pastoral counseling for Catholics who have been spiritually abused, counseling for Catholic ministers, and counseling education so that ministers are more equipped to help others in their ministry. Get full access to Third Space at www.catholicthirdspace.com/subscribe

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• 14: Marcus Mescher - Preferential Option for Survivors

  This is Part Two of a two-part conversation with Dr. Marcus Mescher. In the first part of the conversation we discussed Liberation Theology, its origins, development, and relationship with the universal Church. We also spent time reflecting on the life and work of the Dominican theologian, Gustavo Gutiérrez. In Part-Two, we dive into the Church’s teaching on the preferential options for the poor, exploring its roots in Scripture as well as its relationship to the Ordo Amoris. From there we discuss the importance of the Church having a “preferential options for survivors” and what living that out could look like on an institutional and personal level. I really loved this conversation and I hope you enjoy it as well.If you haven’t listened to Part One, I would encourage you to start with that episode.LINKS:Measuring & Exploring Moral Injury Caused by Clergy Sexual Abusehttps://www.xavier.edu/moral-injury-report/“Moral Injury and Clerical Sexual Abuse” PFG podcast with Marcus Mescherhttps://www.catholicthirdspace.com/p/marcus-mescher-moral-injury-and-clericalThe Liberation Theology PodcastEp. 5: Catholic Social Teaching and Liberation Theology with Marcus Mescher, Pt. 1https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/ep-5-catholic-social-teaching-and-liberation-theology/id1551431636?i=1000511104797Accountability, Healing, and Trust: Interdisciplinary Reflections for Ministry in the Midst of the Catholic Sex Abuse Crisishttps://litpress.org/Products/8897/Accountability-Healing-and-TrustAwake Bloghttps://www.awakecommunity.org/blogABOUT THIRD SPACE: Third Space is the podcast for those who see the beauty of Catholicism, as well as the ugliness, who have experienced real harm AND real grace in the Church. Every episode I will have conversations with guests about the good and the bad in the Church—avoiding easy answers or black & white fundamentalism—in order to hold on to all that is true.SUPPORT THIS SHOW: Please consider becoming a paid subscriber. All of your support directly helps my family and allows me to continue working on projects like this podcast, the newsletter, as well as resources about spiritual abuse in the Catholic Church.www.catholicthirdspace.comABOUT THE HOST: Paul Fahey lives in Michigan with his wife and five kids. He is a limited licensed professional counselor, retreat leader, and catechist. He is a co-founder of Where Peter Is, founder and co-host of the Pope Francis Generation podcast, and the host of the Third Space podcast. He seeks to provide pastoral counseling for Catholics who have been spiritually abused, counseling for Catholic ministers, and counseling education so that ministers are more equipped to help others in their ministry. Get full access to Third Space at www.catholicthirdspace.com/subscribe

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• 13: Marcus Mescher - Liberation Theology

  This is Part One of a two-part conversation with Dr. Marcus Mescher. In the first part of the conversation we discuss Liberation Theology, its origins, development, and relationship with the universal Church. We also spend time reflecting on the life and work of the Dominican theologian, Gustavo Gutiérrez. In Part-Two, we will dove into the Church’s teaching on the preferential options for the poor, exploring its roots in Scripture as well as its relationship to the Ordo Amoris. From there we discussed the importance of the Church having a “preferential options for survivors” and what living that out could look like on an institutional and personal level. I really loved this conversation and I hope you enjoy it as well.Dr. Marcus Mescher is associate professor of Christian ethics. He holds a Ph.D. from Boston College and specializes in Catholic social teaching and moral formation. His research and writing concentrate in the following areas: human dignity and rights; social/environmental justice for the global common good; how moral agency is impacted by cultural context and digital technology; the moral dimensions of friendship; sexual justice and the ethics of marriage and family life; liberation theology and inclusive solidarity; healing the psychological, spiritual, social, and moral harm caused by clergy abuse. Dr. Mescher has written dozens of popular and academic articles. His current research and writing focus on mental health and moral injury.LINKS:Measuring & Exploring Moral Injury Caused by Clergy Sexual Abusehttps://www.xavier.edu/moral-injury-report/“Moral Injury and Clerical Sexual Abuse” PFG podcast with Marcus Mescherhttps://www.catholicthirdspace.com/p/marcus-mescher-moral-injury-and-clericalThe Liberation Theology PodcastEp. 5: Catholic Social Teaching and Liberation Theology with Marcus Mescher, Pt. 1https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/ep-5-catholic-social-teaching-and-liberation-theology/id1551431636?i=1000511104797Accountability, Healing, and Trust: Interdisciplinary Reflections for Ministry in the Midst of the Catholic Sex Abuse Crisishttps://litpress.org/Products/8897/Accountability-Healing-and-TrustAwake Bloghttps://www.awakecommunity.org/blogABOUT THIRD SPACE: Third Space is the podcast for those who see the beauty of Catholicism, as well as the ugliness, who have experienced real harm AND real grace in the Church. Every episode I will have conversations with guests about the good and the bad in the Church—avoiding easy answers or black & white fundamentalism—in order to hold on to all that is true.SUPPORT THIS SHOW: Please consider becoming a paid subscriber. All of your support directly helps my family and allows me to continue working on projects like this podcast, the newsletter, as well as resources about spiritual abuse in the Catholic Church.www.catholicthirdspace.comABOUT THE HOST: Paul Fahey lives in Michigan with his wife and five kids. He is a limited licensed professional counselor, retreat leader, and catechist. He is a co-founder of Where Peter Is, founder and co-host of the Pope Francis Generation podcast, and the host of the Third Space podcast. He seeks to provide pastoral counseling for Catholics who have been spiritually abused, counseling for Catholic ministers, and counseling education so that ministers are more equipped to help others in their ministry. Get full access to Third Space at www.catholicthirdspace.com/subscribe

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• 12: Esther Harber - Closest to the Heart of Jesus

  This week I spoke with Esther Harber. Esther is the Survivor Care Coordinator for Awake and a survivors of sexual assault by a Catholic priest. In this discussion she shares her own story and how her experiences of harm have impacted her faith. Esther has maybe the biggest heart of anyone I’ve ever met. And her capacity to be present with others and hold their stories is profound. I’m so grateful to share our conversation.*A trigger warning that this episode inclues conversation about sexual assaultEsther Harber is a devoted Catholic living with her husband and daughters in Ohio. She is a convert from a fundamentalist Protestant denomination, and was blessed to enter the Catholic Church in 2006. The Lord placed a passion in her heart for sharing the faith, and she spent the better part of her twenties as a lay missionary in New York City. She was also in religious life for a year. During her time as a missionary she experienced spiritual abuse, grooming, and sexual assault by a Catholic priest. After a long period of healing, she felt the Lord calling her to walk with other victim-survivors and to bring light to this crisis in the Church. Esther is the Survivor Care Coordinator for Awake.LINKS:Esther’s Survivor Story:https://www.awakecommunity.org/blog/esther-harber/Contact Esther or Awake:https://www.awakecommunity.org/contactABOUT THIRD SPACE: Third Space is the podcast for those who see the beauty of Catholicism, as well as the ugliness, who have experienced real harm AND real grace in the Church. Every episode I will have conversations with guests about the good and the bad in the Church—avoiding easy answers or black & white fundamentalism—in order to hold on to all that is true.SUPPORT THIS SHOW: Please consider becoming a paid subscriber. All of your support directly helps my family and allows me to continue working on projects like this podcast, the newsletter, as well as resources about spiritual abuse in the Catholic Church.www.catholicthirdspace.comABOUT THE HOST: Paul Fahey lives in Michigan with his wife and five kids. He is a limited licensed professional counselor, retreat leader, and catechist. He is a co-founder of Where Peter Is, founder and co-host of the Pope Francis Generation podcast, and the host of the Third Space podcast. He seeks to provide pastoral counseling for Catholics who have been spiritually abused, counseling for Catholic ministers, and counseling education so that ministers are more equipped to help others in their ministry. Get full access to Third Space at www.catholicthirdspace.com/subscribe

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• 11: Sr. Carino Hodder - Conscience and Vulnerability

  This week I had a wonderful conversation with Sr. Carino Hodder from the The Dominican Sisters of St. Joseph. I first met Sr. Carino when she participated in one of my online workshops about spiritual abuse in the Catholic Church. Since then we’ve had several conversations about safeguarding, abuse of conscience, and the role of the catechist. I’ve really valued her perspective and insights. She has recently written a couple of articles on those topics, which seemed like a great excuse to have her on the podcast to talk about vulnerability, conscience, and the role of the catechist.Sr. Carino Hodder is a Dominican Sister of Saint Joseph based in the New Forest in England. She assists her community with their apostolate of training catechists, primarily as a tutor on their Certificate in Catechesis. Since becoming a sister, she has worked as a First Holy Communion catechist, a Confirmation catechist, and a parish sister in a parish in London, as well as being involved in ongoing formation for all age groups. She also writes regularly for The Lamp magazine and has contributed to other publications including Where Peter Is, The Pillar, and Plough.LINKS:The Dominican Sisters of St. Josephhttps://www.dominicansisters.net/Light of Truth: Live Catholic Formation for Everyonehttps://www.lightoftruth.uk/Freedom, Safety and Vulnerabilityhttps://wherepeteris.com/freedom-safety-and-vulnerability/Vulnerability and the Conscience in Catechesishttps://wherepeteris.com/vulnerability-and-the-conscience-in-catechesis/Substitute for Virtue: On the exercise of charisms without gracehttps://thelampmagazine.com/blog/substitute-virtueABOUT THIRD SPACE: Third Space is the podcast for those who see the beauty of Catholicism, as well as the ugliness, who have experienced real harm AND real grace in the Church. Every episode I will have conversations with guests about the good and the bad in the Church—avoiding easy answers or black & white fundamentalism—in order to hold on to all that is true.SUPPORT THIS SHOW: Please consider becoming a paid subscriber. All of your support directly helps my family and allows me to continue working on projects like this podcast, the newsletter, as well as resources about spiritual abuse in the Catholic Church.www.catholicthirdspace.comABOUT THE HOST: Paul Fahey lives in Michigan with his wife and five kids. He is a limited licensed professional counselor, retreat leader, and catechist. He is a co-founder of Where Peter Is, founder and co-host of the Pope Francis Generation podcast, and the host of the Third Space podcast. He seeks to provide pastoral counseling for Catholics who have been spiritually abused, counseling for Catholic ministers, and counseling education so that ministers are more equipped to help others in their ministry. Get full access to Third Space at www.catholicthirdspace.com/subscribe

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