Emotional Sobriety: The Next Step in Recovery
Allen Berger & Thom Rutledge

Latest episode
237 episodes
- Thom’s Nutshell: Challenge your low self esteem and surprise yourself (I did).
Cognitive Behavioral Therapy (CBT), which was developed in the 60’s by Aaron Beck, dovetails nicely with some of Bill W.’s ideas. Rooted in observing, not denying, but recognizing “I’m becoming defensive “, “I’m taking this personally,” etc. Thom, Patrick, and Joe C. talk cognition before reaction and living in the pause.
Our music is provided by the great southern artist Jefferson Ross. Learn more about Jefferson at jeffersonross.com
Visit our website:
www.emotionalsobriety.info
Learn more about Joe C., Secular AA and Rebellion Dogs here:
https://rebelliondogspublishing.com
Follow us on social media:
Instagram: thomrutledge2
Joe C. Twitter: @Rebellion_Dogs
Friendly Circle Berlin workshops: https://friendlycircleberlin.org/events
Allen’s book, 12 Essential Insights for Emotional Sobriety: https://www.amazon.com/12-Essential-Insights-Emotional-Sobriety/dp/1955415129/
Join Allen & Thom at our Thursday night, 7pm PST Zoom meeting on Emotional Sobriety and the Steps (login information below):
https://zoom.us/j/330149513
Password: 375986
For our ongoing workshop video series on Emotional Sobriety and the 12 Steps, visit our YouTube channel here:
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCHEM2-kqLkfp3I4c0jy-X-g
Also, please join our “Emotional Sobriety and Recovery” FB Group at the following link:
https://www.facebook.com/groups/120450976662519
We’d love to stay in touch in between meetings.
We appreciate feedback! Contact Patrick, our producer, at pndirective4@gmail.com for any questions or comments.
Chapters
(00:00:07) - The Next Step in Recovery: Challenge Your Low Self-Este
(00:07:02) - The Problem With Talking To Clients
(00:10:42) - Can You Read People's Minds?
(00:16:12) - Physical and Emotional Sobriety
(00:20:59) - On Relationships and Getting Out Of Them
(00:21:59) - Don't Have to Be Understanded - Thom’s Nutshell:
Don’t make the mistake of thinking you have no impact in this world of ours. You do.
Whether from a pebble or a giant rock, we’re all leaving ripples in the pond. Allen, Thom, and Patrick discuss the illusion of separateness permeating our human bonds. Emotional sobriety can resolve the crises caused by looking towards other people to validate our existence when we don’t think we matter.
Being responsible to others is accepting responsibility to ourselves. Thom and Allen discuss amends and earning our own respect.
Rest in peace Glen Hansard.
Our music is provided by the great southern artist Jefferson Ross. Learn more about Jefferson at jeffersonross.com
Visit our website:
www.emotionalsobriety.info
Learn more about Joe C., Secular AA and Rebellion Dogs here:
https://rebelliondogspublishing.com
Follow us on social media:
Instagram: thomrutledge2
Joe C. Twitter: @Rebellion_Dogs
Friendly Circle Berlin workshops: https://friendlycircleberlin.org/events
Allen’s book, 12 Essential Insights for Emotional Sobriety: https://www.amazon.com/12-Essential-Insights-Emotional-Sobriety/dp/1955415129/
Join Allen & Thom at our Thursday night, 7pm PST Zoom meeting on Emotional Sobriety and the Steps (login information below):
https://zoom.us/j/330149513
Password: 375986
For our ongoing workshop video series on Emotional Sobriety and the 12 Steps, visit our YouTube channel here:
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCHEM2-kqLkfp3I4c0jy-X-g
Also, please join our “Emotional Sobriety and Recovery” FB Group at the following link:
https://www.facebook.com/groups/120450976662519
We’d love to stay in touch in between meetings.
We appreciate feedback! Contact Patrick, our producer, at pndirective4@gmail.com for any questions or comments.
Chapters
(00:00:00) - Emotional Sobriety: Next Step in Recovery
(00:01:36) - You Deserve to Matter
(00:07:52) - The Importance of Reality
(00:10:02) - Codependents: The Joy of Living
(00:17:35) - "I Made My Amends To My Mom"
(00:18:29) - Tom Brady on Responsibility - Thom’s Nutshell:
The ability to speak several languages is an asset, but the ability to keep your mouth shut in any language is priceless.
Seeking truth through withholding judgment. What makes it difficult to keep our mouths shut. The Odyssey, grades in school, “won’t” drink versus “can’t” drink. What is the suffering that breaks us open and makes us susceptible to change?
Our music is provided by the great southern artist Jefferson Ross. Learn more about Jefferson at jeffersonross.com
Visit our website:
www.emotionalsobriety.info
Learn more about Joe C., Secular AA and Rebellion Dogs here:
https://rebelliondogspublishing.com
Follow us on social media:
Instagram: thomrutledge2
Joe C. Twitter: @Rebellion_Dogs
Friendly Circle Berlin workshops: https://friendlycircleberlin.org/events
Allen’s book, 12 Essential Insights for Emotional Sobriety: https://www.amazon.com/12-Essential-Insights-Emotional-Sobriety/dp/1955415129/
Join Allen & Thom at our Thursday night, 7pm PST Zoom meeting on Emotional Sobriety and the Steps (login information below):
https://zoom.us/j/330149513
Password: 375986
For our ongoing workshop video series on Emotional Sobriety and the 12 Steps, visit our YouTube channel here:
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCHEM2-kqLkfp3I4c0jy-X-g
Also, please join our “Emotional Sobriety and Recovery” FB Group at the following link:
https://www.facebook.com/groups/120450976662519
We’d love to stay in touch in between meetings.
We appreciate feedback! Contact Patrick, our producer, at pndirective4@gmail.com for any questions or comments.
Chapters
(00:00:07) - Coming to Alcoholics: The Next Step in Recovery
(00:01:03) - Can We Ever Come Home?
(00:02:11) - Alcoholics on the Recovery Process
(00:06:04) - Tom Rutledge: The Key to Life
(00:08:55) - The Value of Listening
(00:14:38) - Tom and Alan on Their Most Toxic Relationship
(00:17:36) - Non-Judgmental Musings for 12 Step Life
(00:23:43) - Know the Meaning of Your Life
(00:24:53) - Should We Suspend Our Judgment of Trump?
(00:30:29) - Open Minds on the Divorce
(00:34:43) - Can I Be Active Azealously? - Thom’s Nutshell:
If you measure your well being according to how others treat you, you are choosing a life over which you have no control. This is voluntary victimization.
Allen brings in his study of a “reflective sense of self” as we discuss the ways our difficulties with emotional sobriety impact those we love. Thom and Joe re-explore stoicism through the lens of emotional dependency. Our fear of life is really a fear of emotions.
Patrick reads a passage from Adult Children of Emotionally Immature Parents: How to Heal from Distant, Rejecting, or Self-Involved Parents by Lindsay Gibson.
Our music is provided by the great southern artist Jefferson Ross. Learn more about Jefferson at jeffersonross.com
Visit our website:
www.emotionalsobriety.info
Learn more about Joe C., Secular AA and Rebellion Dogs here:
https://rebelliondogspublishing.com
Follow us on social media:
Instagram: thomrutledge2
Joe C. Twitter: @Rebellion_Dogs
Friendly Circle Berlin workshops: https://friendlycircleberlin.org/events
Allen’s book, 12 Essential Insights for Emotional Sobriety: https://www.amazon.com/12-Essential-Insights-Emotional-Sobriety/dp/1955415129/
Join Allen & Thom at our Thursday night, 7pm PST Zoom meeting on Emotional Sobriety and the Steps (login information below):
https://zoom.us/j/330149513
Password: 375986
For our ongoing workshop video series on Emotional Sobriety and the 12 Steps, visit our YouTube channel here:
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCHEM2-kqLkfp3I4c0jy-X-g
Also, please join our “Emotional Sobriety and Recovery” FB Group at the following link:
https://www.facebook.com/groups/120450976662519
We’d love to stay in touch in between meetings.
We appreciate feedback! Contact Patrick, our producer, at pndirective4@gmail.com for any questions or comments.
Chapters
(00:00:07) - Emotional Recovery: The Next Step in Recovery
(00:02:33) - This Reflective Sense of Self
(00:06:57) - Dr. Matt Ramon on
(00:12:13) - The Stochics on Emotions
(00:15:30) - How Emotional Inebriation Affects Their Adult Lives
(00:21:31) - "Tell Me What You Need"
(00:22:05) - How to Realize Your Potential in Emotional Sobriety - Thom’s Nutshell:
Look for the benefit in all situations - practice positive opportunism.
In another passage from Joe C.’s Beyond Belief, Allen ties our daily reflection to Emotional Sobriety and the importance of dislodging our false self in pursuit of an emboldened authentic one.
Our music is provided by the great southern artist Jefferson Ross. Learn more about Jefferson at jeffersonross.com
Visit our website:
www.emotionalsobriety.info
Learn more about Joe C., Secular AA and Rebellion Dogs here:
https://rebelliondogspublishing.com
Follow us on social media:
Instagram: thomrutledge2
Joe C. Twitter: @Rebellion_Dogs
Friendly Circle Berlin workshops: https://friendlycircleberlin.org/events
Allen’s book, 12 Essential Insights for Emotional Sobriety: https://www.amazon.com/12-Essential-Insights-Emotional-Sobriety/dp/1955415129/
Join Allen & Thom at our Thursday night, 7pm PST Zoom meeting on Emotional Sobriety and the Steps (login information below):
https://zoom.us/j/330149513
Password: 375986
For our ongoing workshop video series on Emotional Sobriety and the 12 Steps, visit our YouTube channel here:
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCHEM2-kqLkfp3I4c0jy-X-g
Also, please join our “Emotional Sobriety and Recovery” FB Group at the following link:
https://www.facebook.com/groups/120450976662519
We’d love to stay in touch in between meetings.
We appreciate feedback! Contact Patrick, our producer, at pndirective4@gmail.com for any questions or comments.
Chapters
(00:00:07) - Alan Berger on Getting Back to the Future
(00:04:06) - The Big Book of Alcoholics Anonymous
(00:08:27) - Don't Say AA '
(00:11:41) - Thomas Had Enough of the False Self
(00:16:00) - Living With Your Value System
(00:21:52) - In the Simpsons Episode 8,
(00:24:57) - Happy Hour: Positive Opportunism and Emotional Sobriety
(00:26:24) - How to Control Your Thoughts
(00:30:34) - Positive Opportunism in Life
(00:34:09) - Alan on Bad Mouth and AA
More Education podcasts
Trending Education podcasts
About Emotional Sobriety: The Next Step in Recovery
Bill Wilson, co-founder of Alcoholic's Anonymous, wrote in 1952, "If we examine every disturbance we have, great or small, we will find at the root some unhealthy dependence and its consequent demand." Wilson suggested that if we could identify and continually surrender these unrealistic and unrecognizable demands, that we may then be able to accomplish what he imagined to be recovery's next frontier - something he called emotional sobriety.
Flash forward 70 years, and join psychotherapists and best-selling authors Thom Rutledge and Dr. Allen Berger, who have taken up the mantle of exploring Bill Wilson's new frontier. Welcome to Emotional Sobriety.
Podcast websiteListen to Emotional Sobriety: The Next Step in Recovery, IT IS WHAT IT IS! and many other podcasts from around the world with the radio.net app

Get the free radio.net app
- Stations and podcasts to bookmark
- Stream via Wi-Fi or Bluetooth
- Supports Carplay & Android Auto
- Many other app features
Get the free radio.net app
- Stations and podcasts to bookmark
- Stream via Wi-Fi or Bluetooth
- Supports Carplay & Android Auto
- Many other app features


Emotional Sobriety: The Next Step in Recovery
Scan code,
download the app,
start listening.
download the app,
start listening.
Emotional Sobriety: The Next Step in Recovery: Podcasts in Family
































