MoneyNeverSleeps

Citi Institute's "Tokenization 2030: Wall Street OnChain" puts a number on it: $5.5 trillion in tokenized assets by 2030. Alejandro Gutierrez, who leads Solana Superteam Ireland and returns for another appearance on the show, joins me to stress-test that forecast — what Citi gets right with DTCC, NYSE and Nasdaq embedding tokenization into core infrastructure, and what we think it misses, including the stablecoin-treasury flywheel, the pressure native issuers like Ondo and Superstate are putting on incumbents, Ireland and Luxembourg's combined funds industry as an underrated jurisdictional play, and why 24/7 markets are really built for AI agents, not retail traders.
Read the full report, "Tokenization 2030: Wall Street Onchain," Citi Institute, June 2026: https://www.citigroup.com/global/insights/tokenization-2030
Castle DAO, the Solana builder residency at Slane Castle: https://tally.so/r/ODJv1k
Follow Alejandro on X and LinkedIn: https://x.com/A_gutierrohttps://www.linkedin.com/in/alejandro-gutierrez-98979b43/Follow Superteam Ireland on X: https://x.com/SuperteamIEhttps://www.linkedin.com/company/superteam-ireland/

CHAPTERS
00:00 Cold open — for the agents
00:37 Introduction
01:18 Citi's stated case: three drivers behind $5.5 trillion
02:19 Is public equities at $3.6 trillion an aggressive number?
03:25 Public permissionless vs. private permissioned chains
04:30 The flywheel Citi missed: stablecoins, treasuries and collateral
06:28 24/7 isn't for retail — it's for the agents
08:50 Ondo, Superstate and the pressure on incumbents
10:53 Ireland, Luxembourg and the €12.5 trillion opportunity
12:02 The wrapper problem: tokenized funds without tokenized holdings
12:41 Castle DAO at Slane Castle
MoneyNeverSleeps — sharp riffs, big ideas, and real insights from smart people, in under 15 minutes. Hosted by early-stage investor Pete Townsend, GP at Norio Ventures, sitting at the intersection of crypto, fintech, AI and onchain finance.
Website: moneyneversleeps.ie
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/petetownsendnv/
X/Twitter: https://x.com/PeteTownsendNV
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/petetownsend353/
Email: info@norioventures.com

Martin Watkins is CEO of Montis Group, which is building a blockchain-native central securities depository — the settlement and issuance layer that makes tokenized assets work as real financial products.
With 30 years inside Euroclear, AtosEuronext and EY, Martin chose to build the infrastructure the market was missing rather than keep advising on the existing system. We get into what a digital CSD unlocks for collateral mobility, why the ECB's DLT eligibility confirmation matters, and what Luxembourg's Blockchain Law IV could mean for Ireland's €5 trillion funds industry.
Find Martin at info@montis.digital or visit montis.digital
Subscribe on Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/4F8uOLxiscYVWVGEfNxTnd

CHAPTERS
00:00 The doom loop that tokenization solves
00:27 Introduction
01:13 Martin Watkins welcome
01:18 30 years inside the plumbing of capital markets
03:50 What a blockchain-native CSD does differently
05:48 The Friday afternoon collateral problem
06:22 The 24/7 problem in tokenized funds
07:46 The Irish question: settlement finality and €5 trillion in fund assets
09:27 Legal certainty, portfolio managers and the velocity of capital
10:39 Why the market infrastructure isn't there yet — but nearly is
11:20 How to reach Martin and Montis

MoneyNeverSleeps: Sharp riffs, big ideas and real insights from smart people — all in under 15 minutes. Hosted by early-stage investor Pete Townsend with the people rebuilding money, markets, and the internet from the ground up.
moneyneversleeps.ie
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/petetownsendnv/
X/Twitter: https://x.com/PeteTownsendNV
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/petetownsend353/
Email: info@norioventures.com

Pete Townsend is joined by Eric Ries, author of the New York Times bestseller The Lean Startup and founder of the Long-Term Stock Exchange, for a conversation about the invisible structural forces that corrupt even the most mission-driven companies, and what founders can do about it before it's too late.
Eric's new book, Incorruptible: Why Good Companies Go Bad and How Great Companies Stay Great, is out now. Get it here: https://www.amazon.com/Incorruptible-Good-Companies-Great-Stay/dp/B0FWZZBPZB
Eric spent 15 years teaching a generation how to build fast and learn faster. Incorruptible asks the harder question: how do you protect what you built from the forces that will eventually try to take it from you?
In this special double-length episode, he walks through the concept of financial gravity, the structural tools that the world's most durable companies have used for over a century, and why good intentions are never enough.
Topics covered:– Why corporate corruption is a structural failure, not an ethical one
– What financial gravity is and why it's invisible until it's too late
– The Anthropic Long-Term Benefit Trust and what it was designed to protect against
– How Novo Nordisk built a structure 100 years ago that protected $500 billion in shareholder value
– Why Silicon Valley Bank's mission statement was worthless
– The one two-page filing most founders never make
CHAPTERS
00:00 The More Golden the Goose
00:23 Welcome Eric Ries
01:06 The Founder's Wake
05:08 What Did The Lean Startup Miss?
08:09 What is Financial Gravity?
12:50 The Right Architecture
13:11 Anthropic and the Long-Term Benefit Trust
14:59 The Novo Nordisk Story
18:18 Are You Smarter Than a Nobel Laureate?
19:28 The Vatican Panel
20:46 The Public Benefit Corporation
22:41 Is LTSE Incorruptible?
23:39 The Guardian of the Company's Soul
Connect with Eric:X: https://x.com/ericries
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/eries/
Incorruptible (book): https://incorruptible.co
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/ericriesactual/
Newsletter: https://news.theleanstartup.com/
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@theericriesshow
Podcast: https://www.ericriesshow.co
Buy on Amazon: https://www.amazon.com/Incorruptible-Good-Companies-Great-Stay/dp/B0FWZZBPZB
Connect with Pete:X: @PeteTownsendNV
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/petetownsendnv/
Norio Ventures: https://norioventures.com
MoneyNeverSleeps: https://moneyneversleeps.ie#incorruptible #leanstartup #founders #startups

Pete Townsend is joined by Sal Ternullo, CEO of SVRN and Managing Partner at A100x Ventures, for a conversation about how to tell the difference between a token that represents ownership of the value-creating thing and one that's an accelerant bolted onto something else.Sal has been underwriting these decisions at A100x at the pre-seed and seed stage. He walks through what's actually changed in the market, what a defensible answer on value accrual sounds like in a pitch meeting, and why the race-to-TGE game that defined the last cycle is largely over.Topics covered:– Why the era of tolerating tokens with no claim on cash flows is ending– How to tell whether a founder has real conviction on decentralization or is bolting a token onto an equity business– The cap-table tensions between SAFEs, token warrants, and Series A investors who can't touch tokens– Why building the product before designing the token is the new discipline– The question Sal wishes more founders walked in with an answer toCHAPTERS:00:00 Bad Tokens Ruin Good Projects00:30 Welcome Sal Ternullo01:10 What Changed in Token Value Accrual03:00 Equity vs. Token: Where Does Value Accrue04:55 Signs a Founder Has Real Conviction06:15 Ownership or Loyalty Points08:30 Tokens After 18 Months: Pump.fun and the Lag10:00 The Race to TGE Game is Over11:30 The Cap Table Reality13:00 The Question Founders Should AskConnect with Sal:X: @sal_ternulloEmail: sal@svrn.netSVRN: https://svrn.netA100x Ventures: https://a100x.vcConnect with Pete:X: @PeteTownsendNVLinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/petetownsendnv/Norio Ventures: https://norioventures.comMoneyNeverSleeps: https://moneyneversleeps.ie#crypto #venturecapital #tokens

You Can't Code Your Way Out | Amor Sexton, Blockdaemon
In the last few weeks, Drift and Kelp lost $577 million between them. Neither one was a code exploit. Both were operational and governance failures.
Amor Sexton, Chief Operating Officer at Blockdaemon, was last on MoneyNeverSleeps in October 2022 (EP 193) talking about how institutional client expectations of resilient processes would drive blockchain adoption. Three and a half years later, the industry just got an extremely expensive lesson in exactly that thesis.
In this episode, Pete and Amor get into:
- Why "this isn't a hack, it's a governance failure" is the conversation the industry isn't having
- How compliance is a subset of risk — and why DeFi keeps confusing the two
- The Web2/human layer compromise that exploits a legitimate Web3 feature
- Pluto on Castle Island: "Everything that TradFi has built in terms of circuit breakers, we're just speed running relearning those things in crypto"
- The Kelp configuration was a known vulnerability — and 47% of operators chose it anyway
- The two or three governance questions every DeFi protocol and LP should be asking right now
- Why it always comes back to people, not code
Chapters:
00:00 Cold open
00:24 Welcome back to MoneyNeverSleeps
00:55 $577M, 18 days, no code exploit
02:00 Compliance is a subset of risk
03:15 Guardrails and governance
04:30 The Web2 layer compromise
05:45 Speedrunning what TradFi already built
07:30 Why 47% chose the risky configuration
09:00 Three governance questions every protocol should answer
12:30 It always comes back to people
13:30 Sign off
Connect with Amor:
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/amor-sexton/
Blockdaemon: https://www.blockdaemon.com/
About MoneyNeverSleeps:
MoneyNeverSleeps is hosted by Pete Townsend, GP at Norio Ventures. Sharp riffs, big ideas, and real insights from smart people in crypto, fintech, AI, and onchain finance.
Connect with Pete:
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/petetownsendnv/
X: @petetownsendnv
Norio Ventures: https://www.norioventures.com
Subscribe to MoneyNeverSleeps wherever you get your podcasts:
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@moneyneversleeps1814
Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/4F8uOLxiscYVWVGEfNxTnd
Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/ie/podcast/moneyneversleeps/id1455819294
#MoneyNeverSleeps #Blockdaemon #DeFi #Crypto #AmorSexton #Governance #RiskManagement